70 Weeks

Discussion in 'Bible Prophecy' started by Joshuastone7, Feb 6, 2014.

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    Joshuastone7

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    Let's take a look at the prophetic fulfillment's of the prophecies found in the 9th chapter of Daniel from versus 24-27.

    “There are 70 weeks that have been determined for your people and your holy city, in order to terminate the transgression, to finish off sin, to make atonement for error, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up the vision and the prophecy, and to anoint the Holy of Holies." (Dan 9:24)

    In the first verse we are to cover we see a complete overview of what may be looked forward to in the process of these 70 weeks. Included is the termination of transgression which of course refers to the "transgression causing desolation" within Jehovah's temple here on earth. We see as well a decree that sin itself will end, as well an atonement of error in that of Jesus sacrifice. We will see the bringing in of everlasting righteousness in that of the new world, and to complete the visions of prophecy as mentioned at Rev 10:7.

    "You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Mes·si′ah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks. She will be restored and rebuilt, with a public square and moat, but in times of distress." (Dan 9:25)

    Now, here we have a starting point for our 70 weeks in that of the word going fourth to restore and rebuild Jerusalem. I'm not going to get into dates here, because there are many schools of thought on exactly what day this occurred, but in all reality it's absolutely irrelevant as it pertains to the prophecies contained and their future fulfillment. We also find in this verse a "she". No doubt this refers to that bride of Christ, the very same "city" that is devastated in the end. We have an initial fulfillment from Artaxerxes to rebuild the Temple that leads us to our next verse.

    “And after the 62 weeks, Mes·si′ah will be cut off, with nothing for himself." (Dan 9:26a)

    This scripture says that after 62 weeks the Messiah would be cut off, in the reading and structure of the last verses of Dan 9 we find that this scripture doesn't say specifically right when these 62 weeks end he would be cut off but rather sometime there after.

    “And the people of a leader who is coming will destroy the city and the holy place. And its end will be by the flood. And until the end there will be war; what is decided upon is desolations." (Dan 9:26b)

    The city and Holy place that is destroyed is the Temple spoken about that was to be rebuilt earlier in the verses. That same Temple in Jerusalem that we know was destroyed in the year 70CE. We also know that Jehovah's current Temple is destined to have a similar fate when it is destroyed during the time of tribulation. (2Th 2, Rev 11)

    “And he will keep the covenant in force for the many for one week;" (Dan 9:27a)

    Here we get into that 70th week, and some very interesting prophetic significance. What is this "Covenant" that is held in force for the many for one week? Let's brake it down. Another way to render this scripture is as such; "when he shall confirm the covenant during many weeks." Also, "And in the end of the week." Agreeing with the Septuagint we read, "the covenant shall prevail for the many during one week". So basically this scripture is saying that Jehovah confirms his covenant to Israel by bringing the Messiah. This is basically a confirmation that this is the moment of the coming Prince, which of course would have been seen the moment Jesus was baptized. It is the covenant to Israel that is completed and held in place for one week. This 70th week began at Jesus baptism and continues it's discussion in the remaining part of the verse.

    "and at the half of the week, he will cause sacrifice and gift offering to cease."
    (Dan 9:27a)

    This "sacrifice and gift offering" that was to cease was the sacrifices and offerings in the Temple. This would have been symbolic of Jehovah's will because Jesus blood once and for ever atoned for human sin and he became that perfect sacrifice at the end of the three and a half years of his ministry. No longer were animal sacrifices needed in order to atone for sin. The end of this week as pointed out by the "Insight Volumes" occurred when the covenant was extended outside the "many" to include the rest of the world when Cornelius become a Christian three and a half years after Jesus's sacrifice.

    “And on the wing of disgusting things there will be the one causing desolation; and until an extermination, what was decided on will be poured out also on the one lying desolate.â€￾ (Dan 9:27b)

    What would be the end result of the prophecy in Dan 9? Of course the destruction of the Temple and then after 1290 days the placing of the discussing thing causing desolation. All of this information would have helped the first century Christians to avoid becoming part of the destruction of the Temple, including the warnings from Jesus at Mat 24:15, as well the warnings in Daniel 12, but how does this effect us today? These prophecies in Dan 9 were recorded to assist the bride class to recognize his coming and to avoid the destruction that was destined on the Temple in the first century and as well in the time of the end.

    In the time of the end the call to rebuild Jerusalem falls on the Jewish holiday of Sukkot, the Feast of Tabernacles, then the 69th week ends the moment the Holy of Holies is anointed when Jesus is enthroned as king at the completion of the 1260 days of captivity and the same moment those remaining of those following Jehovah are anointed of Holy Spirit and the dead in Christ raised. This will be the promised covenant in the time of the end that will be held in place for one week. It appears that after three and a half days the two witnesses will be killed at the half of that 70th week. Then three and a half day later ending the 70th week they are raised and bring a message to the entire world of the events about to occur on it. One can find information on the timeline of the end and how the Jewish holidays come into play in conjunction with the prophecies of Daniel here; Jewish-Holidays-Fullfilled
     
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    Joshuastone7

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    "Protestants try to ascribe the covenant of verse 27 to the Antichrist because "he," they say, refers to "the prince who is to come." But this cannot be! Remember the poetic organization! The key is the word "many." It is literally "the many," and whenever it is used in the Old Testament, it refers to either the covenant people Israel or to the saints, that is, true believers. Jesus says in Matthew 26:28, "For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins." Christ makes the covenant, not Antichrist!"


    "Confirm means "strengthen" or "make firm"—almost to the point of being unbreakable. This helps substantiate its reference to the New Covenant, an everlasting covenant that strengthened the basic requirements of the Old Covenant. Significantly, when Christ in the Olivet Prophecy gives His disciples the signs of the end, He does not mention a covenant or treaty to be enacted between the Antichrist and the Jews, Christians, saints, or anyone! He does mention both of the events Gabriel mentions here: the destruction of Jerusalem in AD 70 (Matthew 24:2) and the abomination of desolation (verse 15)."


    "This may be the most abused verse on the subject of the end times, and it is a linchpin in the Pre-tribulation Rapture theory: "Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; but in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering." "He" in this verse refers to Messiah, not Antichrist, for the main subject of this section is Messiah."


    "Protestants, referring to Isaiah 28:15 and "a covenant with death," say that the Antichrist makes a peace treaty for one week—seven years—with the Jews. But this makes no sense! Why would the Beast "destroy the city [Jerusalem] and the sanctuary" (Daniel 9:26), and "then . . . confirm a covenant . . . for one week" (verse 27) with the vanquished Jews? The timing is wrong! Verses 26-27a speak of events that occurred in the first century."


    "It makes more sense to attribute this covenant to our Savior. He was "cut off, but not for Himself" (verse 26a) by His redemptive death. He had spent 3½ years "confirm[ing] a covenant with many," and "in the middle of the week He[brought] an end to sacrifice and offering" (verse 27a) by the sacrifice of His perfect life. This simply restates what is said in verse 26a."


    "If this is the case, the whole idea of seven years of tribulation vanishes."

    (Bible Tools)
     
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    Shikinah

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    Hi Joshuastone7,

    Thank you for posting on this subject, I have to admit I find these scriptures in Daniel a little confusing, but at the same time we need to understand them as some parts seem to have a future fulfilment but which?.
    I think the confusion on a world wide basis has been a deliberate attempt by the Zionists to make us believe that the following scriptures ALL have a future fulfilment..


    "You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Mes·si′ah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks. She will be restored and rebuilt, with a public square and moat, but in times of distress." (Dan 9:25)


    What many fail to understand is that the Jews don't see this scripture as being fulfilled by our saviour the Lord Jesus christ but by a future messiah which is yet to arrive, they also equate this scripture to a future event, and see Jesus as a false messiah.
    If you don't understand this concept the whole false scenario built up around this scripture appears scriptural. Obviously and hopefully Jehovah's Witnesses wouldn't fall for this deceit, but the average christian would probably be oblivious to the understanding of these prophesies. But then again is satan trying to mislead the average person or the anointed and their sheep?



    “And he will keep the covenant in force for the many for one week;" (Dan 9:27a)
    "and at the half of the week, he will cause sacrifice and gift offering to cease." (Dan 9:27a)
    “And on the wing of disgusting things there will be the one causing desolation; and until an extermination, what was decided on will be poured out also on the one lying desolate.†(Dan 9:27b)

    It would need someone like your self who has studied bible chronology/dates etc to understand the accuracy of this prophesy, as the Zionist Rothschilds plan has always been to try and mimic Jehovah Gods plan by making ALL of these prophesies have a modern day fulfilment starting with the repatriation of the Jews to their so called home land Jerusalem. This is to fulfil the following scripture..

    Isaiah 11:11
    In that day the Lord will reach out his hand a second time to reclaim the surviving remnant of his people from Assyria, from Lower Egypt, from Upper Egypt, from Cush, from Elam, from Babylonia, from Hamath and from the islands of the Mediterranean.

    They wrongly apply this scripture to the nation of Israel, which was deliberately restored with satanic influence, when it should rightly apply to Jehovah's restored people who are calling on his name in the last days. Even their symbol the star of David is an occultic hexagram the Magen
    symbolises two triangles overlapping representing the unholy alliance of angel with women. And this is the identifying mark of the Nation of Israel today.
    This is prophesied and fulfilled in..

    Revelation 3:9 Behold, I will cause those of the synagogue of Satan, who say that they are Jews and are not, but lie-- I will make them come and bow down at your feet, and make them know that I have loved you.

    So those who are of the synagogue of satan are doing his will, by trying to fulfil scripture by creating a false Nation of Israel, who await a false messiah who will sit in their false third temple, which they make sure they'll re-build, even if it sits along side the Dome of Rock, which is their last resort. It's a frightening thought that from what I have read, world war two was started for this very purpose.
    And as I have mentioned before, they already have the blue prints made up, they even have a red cloned heifers for the start of sacrifices, they have a replica made of the golden menorah which was in the original temple and trained levite priests, all of this paid for by lord Rothschilds.

    Will they carry this out? they have been successful so far, the only thing stopping them is the Dome of the rock, but desperate times call for desperate measures and they have already stated that the Dome of the Rock sits where the original temple was, but if worse comes they can build their temple in the court of the gentiles. What could be more disgusting than to see a muslim and anti-christ temple where Jehovahs temple originally stood.

    Mathew 24:15-16 Therefore when you see the Abomination of desolation which was spoken of through Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand),
    then those who are in Judea must flee to the mountains.

    You are probably already aware of the things I have just written, but I thought it's best to let others know also, because this is something the majority are unaware of, and satans last attempt to fool the world in to believing that this false messiah in the flesh is the true prophesied messiah, this is also to try and confirm that Jesus was a false messiah, he will do miracles and mislead the world if possible even the chosen ones. Who especially are not expecting such events to take place? Jehovah's Witnesses, because their faithful and discreet slave have said ALL scripture has been fulfilled except for the destruction of Babylon the great. What a confusing and frightening time it will be, it seems to fit in with the following scriptures..

    Mathew 24:
    42“Therefore be on the alert, for you do not know which day your Lord is coming. 43“But be sure of this, that if the head of the house had known at what time of the night the thief was coming, he would have been on the alert and would not have allowed his house to be broken into. 44“For this reason you also must be ready; for the Son of Man is coming at an hour when you do not think He will. 45“Who then is the faithful and sensible slave whom his master put in charge of his household to give them their food at the proper time? 46“Blessed is that slave whom his master finds so doing when he comes.47“Truly I say to you that he will put him in charge of all his possessions. 48“But if that evil slave says in his heart, ‘My master is not coming for a long time,’ 49and begins to beat his fellow slaves and eat and drink with drunkards; 50the master of that slave will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour which he does not know, 51and will cut him in pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    Apologies for the various fonts..


    Shikinah




     
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    Very astute in your understanding. Yes, this is the most commonly held idea, in that of the physical Jewish people on earth will rebuild their temple and that the Antichrist will have a part in that, and that the 70th and final week of Daniels prophecy is separated by 2000 years from the 69th in order to form a 7 year tribulation... The problem is, this is not based in accurate scriptural teaching when chronology is applied. You were correct when you said chronology was a very important part of understanding prophecy. You cannot have a paradox where you have an action preceding it's creation. Only then may one understand what each event within said chronology portrays.

    An example of just simply how these Christiandom theory's take no regard for continuity is Dan 9:27 & Dan 12:11; "cause sacrifice and gift offering to cease" & "constant feature has been removed".

    (Dan 9:27)
    [TABLE]
    [TR]
    [TD]2077 [e][/TD]
    [TD]ze-ḇaḥ[/TD]
    [TD]זֶ֣בַח[/TD]
    [TD]he shall cause the sacrifice[/TD]
    [TD]Noun[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]4503 [e][/TD]
    [TD]ū-min-ḥāh,[/TD]
    [TD]וּמִנְחָ֗ה[/TD]
    [TD]and the offering[/TD]
    [TD]Noun[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    (Dan 12:11)
    [TABLE]
    [TR]
    [TD]5493 [e][/TD]
    [TD]hū-sar[/TD]
    [TD]הוּסַ֣ר[/TD]
    [TD][sacrifice] shall be taken away[/TD]
    [TD]Verb[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [TR]
    [TD]8548 [e][/TD]
    [TD]hat-tā-mîḏ,[/TD]
    [TD]הַתָּמִ֔יד[/TD]
    [TD][that] the daily[/TD]
    [TD]Noun[/TD]
    [/TR]
    [/TABLE]

    These two scripture are not describing the same event and is a common mistake for someone just breezing through. The noun hat-tā-mîḏ denotes an action, something that has been occurring daily. In fact the word "sacrifice" is added here and does not appear in the original text. It basically reads, "and the continual will be removed".

    The noun ze-bah is simply describing an action that is "a sacrifice". In many other places in scripture this word is used to denote a singular sacrifice.

    Once we factor in chronology and common sense we know that the 70th week began the moment the 69th ended, for the scripture clearly says, "You should know and understand that from the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Mes·si′ah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks." (Dan 9:25) We then know that the covenant was put in force when Jehovah concluded his promise to Israel for a Messiah the moment Jesus was baptized. Then at the half of that 70th week "sacrifice and gift offering ceased" when Jesus was impaled as a sacrifice for all men, while at that same moment causing the sacrifices at the Temple to become irrelevant and unnecessary. Hence forth at the conclusion of that final 70th week the covenant was not just for the "many" (the Jewish nation), it was also extended to the Gentiles as well, with Cornelius on.

    I don't know that I want to get into the last verses of Dan 12, cause that will lead me into Rev and on and on and I wont stop typing...lol So, I'll just add a few translations that correctly denote what is commonly misunderstood about Daniel 12:11. There is a time period between the constant feature being removed and the disgusting thing placed, these two events do not and have never occurred at the same moment. From their first fulfillment on down to the future time of the end.

    Daniel 12:11 (CEB) | In Context | Whole Chapter

    "11 There will be one thousand two hundred ninety days from the time the daily sacrifice is stopped to the setting up of the desolating monstrosity."

    Daniel 12:11 (CEV)
    | In Context|Whole Chapter

    "11 There will be one thousand two hundred ninety days from the time that the daily sacrifices are stopped, until someone sets up the “Horrible Thing†that causes destruction."

    Daniel 12:11 (ERV) | In Context | Whole Chapter

    "11 “The daily sacrifice will be stopped. There will be 1290 days from that time until the time that the terrible thing that destroys is set up."

    Daniel 12:11 (EXB) | In Context | Whole Chapter

    "11 “The ·daily [regular] sacrifice [8:12] will be ·stopped [turned away]. Then, after 1,290 days from that time, ·a blasphemous object that brings destruction [L the abomination of desolation; 11:31] will be set up."

    Daniel 12:11 (NCV) | In Context | Whole Chapter

    "11 “The daily sacrifice will be stopped. Then, after 1,290 days from that time, a blasphemous object that brings destruction will be set up."


    Okay, well I guess I'm in a chronological mood so I'll paste a few more points...

    [​IMG]
    {2300 Starts} Watchtower News Reports: Sept 10th 2018; Festival of Trumpets
    |
    {965 Days Pass}
    |
    {1260, 1290, 1335 Starts} Watchtower Goes Down: May 1st, 2021

    |
    {777 Days Pass}
    |
    {1742nd Day} Call to Rebuild Jerusalem:
    June 17th, 2023
    |
    {108 Days Pass}
    |
    {1850th Day} USA Collapses:
    Sept 29th-Oct 6th, 2026; Feast of Tabernacles
    |
    {375 Days Pass}
    |
    {1260 Ends} Jesus Enthroned:
    Oct 12th 2024; Day of Atonement
    |
    {30 Days Pass}
    |
    {1290 Ends} Disgusting Thing:
    Nov 11th, 2024
    |
    {45 Days Pass}
    |
    {2300[SUP]th[/SUP], 1335[SUP]th [/SUP]Day} New World:
    Dec 26th, 2024; Hanukkah


     
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    Shikinah

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    Thank you for showing from the scriptures how words can denote a single sacrifice and how the word sacrifice was added.
    Most individuals will skim over what seems to be deep prophesy, this is how the elite have pulled the wool over the eyes of the masses for so long.
    I'm not astute in Bible chronology, and find it quite complex, but I am a digger lol, and if something don't sit right I have to search till I find the answer. Understanding end time prophesy is important, as we don't want to be misled, Jesus said "dig for the truth as hidden treasure" not to just accept what imperfect man tells us, but take some responsibility for our own destiny if that's the appropriate saying :rolleyes:

    I won't begin to try and work out how you come up with the following dates, this call to rebuild Jerusalem you say will actually happen June 15th 2026?
    If the Watchtower goes down May 1st 2021, when does the tribulation occur?

    Thank you
    Shikinah


    {2300 Starts} Watchtower News Reports: Sept 10th 2018; Festival of Trumpets
    |
    {965 Days Pass}
    |
    {1260, 1290, 1335 Starts} Watchtower Goes Down: May 1st, 2021

    |
    {777 Days Pass}
    |
    {1742nd Day} Call to Rebuild Jerusalem:
    June 17th, 2023
    |
    {108 Days Pass}
    |
    {1850th Day} USA Collapses:
    Sept 29th-Oct 6th, 2026; Feast of Tabernacles
    |
    {375 Days Pass}
    |
    {1260 Ends} Jesus Enthroned:
    Oct 12th 2024; Day of Atonement
    |
    {30 Days Pass}
    |
    {1290 Ends} Disgusting Thing:
    Nov 11th, 2024
    |
    {45 Days Pass}
    |
    {2300th,1335th Day} New World:
    Dec 26th, 2024; Hanukkah

     
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    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    The dates included are only the next moment in the stream of time that the Jewish holidays match up with the chronology of Daniel. After these dates, the next time the Jewish holidays fall in line with Daniels chronology would be the start of 2021 and then 2037. I don't mean to seam that I am predicting a date for the time of the end, for none of this information is mine, nor from my own originality. It has been written for us in scripture through inspiration from Jehovah, and all interpretation belongs to him. These two future time periods are simply the remaining two moments left within our life spans when the remaining Jewish holiday yet to be fulfilled coincide with the chronology of Daniel.

    As to how the chronology of Daniel lays as you see it you can read a complete description here; joshuastone7.com. This is the tab at the top of our page that reads "The End Is Here". If you haven't had a chance to read through it, it's not that long and discusses in very simple terms how we come to laying out the end time chronology.

    To answer your question, the Tribulation is basically for those of Jehovah's followers, and then conversely to all. There will be tribulation when Jehovah's people see the constant feature removed and the errors of the society, then its destruction however, once the Holy Spirit is poured at at the end of the 1260 days that tribulation ends and Jesus comes to pass judgement on the whole world.

    So here is a chart with the 70 weeks imposed on the chronology of Daniel;

    [​IMG]
     
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    Shikinah

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    Thank you for explaining, yes I did read your article last year it's quite deep but interesting.
    Sorry to appear ignorant, but exactly what is the "constant feature" I think you mentioned something a while back, that news of the organisations errors will be televised for the world to see? If this is the case, is this when the organisation falls? and from here the "Two Witness' are revealed?
     
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    No problem, and that is a very good question, not ignorant by any means, but shows interest and insight into the deeper things. I like when someone presents a reply, for it gives me something to talk about...:)

    The constant feature is the Watchtower magazine announcing Jehovah's kingdom to the world. Just as in the year 66CE when the constant feature at that time in the form of the sacrifices at the temple for the Roman emperor and people was removed when Jerusalem was surrounded. So the constant feature is the Watchtower Society it's self that is destined to be removed by the little horn.

    Now, there is a period of time before the constant feature is removed, and we find that here; “He will go back and hurl denunciations against the holy covenant and act effectively; and he will go back and will give attention to those leaving the holy covenant." (Dan 11:30) Now this is before the constant feature is removed in the next verse; "And arms will stand up, proceeding from him; and they will profane the sanctuary, the fortress, and remove the constant feature." (Dan 11:31)

    Now, the most important scriptures to inform us as to the "hurling denunciations" is found in Dan 8; "And I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to the one speaking: “How long will the vision of the constant feature and of the transgression causing desolation continue." (Dan 8:13) Here the question laid out is how long will the vision be of the constant feature [intact] and the transgression within the constant feature continue. You will note that the questioner clearly is saying the transgression is seen while the constant feature is still in place. What is the result of this transgression in the Watchtower Society? "to make both the holy place and the army things to trample on?â€￾ (Dan 8:13b) These are the events leading up to and causing the destruction of the constant feature however preceding it.

    How does the small horn accomplish this? We see in an earlier verse at Dan 8:9,10; "Out of one of them came another horn, a small one, and it grew very great toward the south and toward the east and toward the Decoration. It grew so great that it reached all the way to the army of the heavens, and it caused some of the army and some of the stars to fall to the earth, and it trampled them down." Here we see visioned events as the small horn grows in power and "hurls denunciations" toward the Decoration (Watchtower Society) while it still exists. Now, how do we know this time period is before the constant feature is removed? Because this 2300 days ends when the Holy place is returned to it's right condition. (Dan 8:14) So basically not the "Most Holy, or heaven", but the room just outside "the Holy, or the earth" is what is brought into it's right condition. Now this occurs the moment the new world is ushered in at the first day of Jesus's 1000 year reign.

    Without getting to in depth, in Dan 12:12 we also have a moment the new world is ushered in; “Happy is the one who keeps in expectation and who arrives at the 1,335 days!" The 1260 days, 1290 days and 1335 days of the end of Dan 12 all begin on the same day, the day the constant feature is removed.

    Now that gives us a starting point to determine when the 2300 days begin, for both the 2300 days and the 1335 days end on the same day. So once you subtract the 1335 from 2300 you get the number of days before the constant feature is removed where there is a vision of transgression within the Watchtower Society while it's intact and seeing "stars" (basically GB members) brought low to the earth by scandal, and that is 965 days before the Watchtower Society goes down completely.

    As to your last question, the two witnesses begin prophesying in "sackcloth" at the beginning of the 1260 days. It doesn't say this is when they will appear, nor that this is when their prophesying begins but that simply once the constant feature is removed is when they are seen prophesying with "sackcloth" (A term of mourning). In fact it's quite possible that the two witnesses will be seen well before the constant feature is removed by a very small group of people once the time of the end begins with the news reports of errors of the Watchtower Society.
     
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    Thank you, that was really interesting to read.
    What I find difficult to comprehend, is how will the work of the two witnesses be carried out when the watch tower society would have been exposed for all it's wrong doing? How when the name of Jehovah would have been dragged through the mud, will anyone choose to listen to the message of the two witnesses. Does this contribute to them being killed?
     
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    Obviously the two witnesses will have very intimate knowledge of the "Truth about the Truth". So these two will know well in advance the coming events destined to occur on the Watchtower Society and the world. No doubt they will become famous over the whole world for this very thing, after all this is the message they bring to the world. If two had foreknowledge of events to come, lets say an exact date and what is to occur on that date no doubt that in itself would raise attention and be news worthy. For their job is to "Prophecy" which means they will be declaring coming events upon the world in the time of the end. In turn this tells you that they will have that knowledge well before the end, no one learns a lifetime of knowledge in scripture over night. Someone knows what will happen in the end, Jehovah intended prophecy to be understood by someone.

    Describing those in the time after the Watchtower goes down we find insight in prophecies containing their work; "And those having insight among the people will impart understanding to the many." (Dan 11:33) "And those having insight will shine as brightly as the expanse of heaven, and those bringing the many to righteousness like the stars, forever and ever." (Dan 12:3)

    There is no doubt that your question was a very good one, " How when the name of Jehovah would have been dragged through the mud, will anyone choose to listen to the message of the two witnesses." There can be no doubt that what brings two individuals in our world to fame in a positive way in relation to Jehovah's name after it has been completely "drug through the mud" is the fact that Jehovah has chosen them to unravel what has been hidden for so very long. To unseal what has been sealed, and in that way will bring no doubt that they have "truth to impart to the many". (Dan 11:33) Will the whole world listen to a message of Jehovah from two individuals? Well the society has been doing that with millions for over a century now. No, the world will see what they are always searching for, events predetermined to occur on certain dates occurring exactly as these two witnesses predicted. Think about it, their work is to "Prophecy" according to Rev 11. So imagine if they were to prophecy an event that would effect the whole earth, and they know the date and exactly what will happen years before it does, what kind of fame would they have? Now let's say they do this over and over? When Jesus was here on earth, people came out to see him for the show, the drama, to see him heal, to gain gifts, to see miracles, not mostly to hear his message. People haven't changed.

    Of course nothing these two bring is from their own originality, nor would their prophecies be anything of their own creation, but all things are from Jehovah. No one at this moment can claim to be anything nor anyone other then a sinful human with simply a hope to survive the end. Only Jehovah can choose these two in that time he chooses too...
     
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    Shikinah

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    Sorry for late reply brother..
    Thank you for such an in depth reply, it's faith strengthening to know that the two witnesses will intervene, otherwise how else would we know our way out of an organisation which had crumbled, and promised you a spiritual paradise. When you say two, do you literally mean two, or are they two groups one of anointed and of the other sheep? or are they two anointed individuals?

    This scripture is very powerful and to think that this is a future prophesy is awe inspiring, we are very blessed to have such understanding, exciting yet surreal..

    "And those having insight among the people will impart understanding to the many." (Dan 11:33) "And those having insight will shine as brightly as the expanse of heaven, and those bringing the many to righteousness like the stars, forever and ever." (Dan 12:3)
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    These are definitely two individuals. This subject is discussed in great detail in the thread "Two Witnesses" here: Two-Witnesses
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Dan 9:24 “There are 70 weeks that have been determined for your people and your holy city, in order to terminate the transgression,

    This is the transgression that will lead up to the removing of the constant feature. Dan 8:13 "How long will the vision of the constant feature and of the transgression causing desolation continue," Dan 8:12 "And an army was given over, together with the constant feature, because of transgression;"

    to finish off sin,

    Rev 20:14 "And death and the Grave were hurled into the lake of fire."

    to make atonement for error,

    Rev 19:12,13 "His eyes are a fiery flame, and on his head are many diadems. He has a name written that no one knows but he himself, and he is clothed with an outer garment stained with blood, and he is called by the name The Word of God"

    to bring in everlasting righteousness,

    Zech 3:10 "‘In that day,’ declares Jehovah of armies, ‘Each of you will invite your neighbor to come under your vine and under your fig tree.’

    to seal up the vision and the prophecy,

    Rev 10:7 "There will be no delay any longer. But in the days when the seventh angel is about to blow his trumpet, the sacred secret that God declared as good news to his own slaves the prophets is indeed brought to a finish.”

    and to anoint the Holy of Holies."


    Rev 6:2 "And I saw, and look! a white horse, and the one seated on it had a bow; and a crown was given him,"
     

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