NEW TEACHING

Discussion in 'Bible Prophecy' started by apocalypse, Mar 16, 2016.

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    apocalypse

    apocalypse Guest

    The Watchtower is in the midst of changing teachings. You will not hear about this in the WT magazine. You will not hear about this on JW.org or JW TV.

    You WILL hear it in your local Kingdom Hall shortly.

    Circuit Overseers have been given a mandate to introduce the changes in teaching. This is being done to introduce the ground shaking teachings on the sly.

    What you will hear at your next CO visit.

    All you who thought you were of "the Great Crowd" ... are WRONG

    He will demonstrate that Revelation talks about the "Great Crowd"... "coming out of the Great Tribulation" and since the great trib hasn't happened yet, nobody belongs to this yet to be identified group.

    What we learn from this... Rutherford was full of hot air. In 1935 at the Washington convention he had many stand and said "BEHOLD THE GREAT CROWD"... speaking to a fulfillment of Revelation 7

    All those who stood... ARE DEAD. They cannot 'live through the great tribulation'. The dead... do not live.
    If you die, you are not part of the "great crowd".
    To say anyone is part of this future group is preposterous, and as dear slave member Jackson said at the Royal Commission, "it would be presumptuous"
     
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    belongingtojah

    belongingtojah Member

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    Very good point!!!
     
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    That's what I have said for years.... lol

    Besides, there's nothing ground-breaking to this, it's just logical, just like the fact that those who don't have the heavenly calling are more likely to make up the future great crowd, unless God calls them before then. Which is why I said that the anointed have one hope only whereas those who aren't have two prospective hopes...
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    This is interesting, and super pertinent, and is the very reason I resigned from WT in the first place, because I saw the true gospel was not what they /we were following. Not coincidentally, I have just been pointing this out on the post I asked about what is the true temple thread. Just this morning I asked the same question: "Who is the Great Crowd" , then?

    And, 'Who introduced this false interpretation into the JW world thinking'?

    How do you know this? Are you a 'hiding' C.O., or Bethelite, and what do you want us to think about where you are getting this inside dope?

    And wouldn't this be an admission by the WT Society, that they've known ALL ALONG this was false doctrine, but kept it rolling so the Joe-Witness would passively just "Do as I say, and keep your mouth shut!" ?...since only the Governing Body members are 'anointed' and we are just members of a slave/household of faith...not brides-to-be in the Christian flock?
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2016
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    In absolute terms, nothing changes. They just say that the GC is a future entity. Those who aren't anointed and never will be so will make up the future GC anyway.
    Apocalypse, when I said that it wasn't groundbreaking, it wasn't in order to contradict you but I meant that it wasn't an extraordinary feat to deduce this.
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    And if they 'go there', they will have to review the long-standing interpretation of the ssstttrrrreeeeettttttcccccccchhhhhhh' ed 'other sheep' explanation Jesus gave ; an earthly 'class' alongside the heavenly 'class' of Christian when everyone reading it really knew he was obviously foretelling the Gentiles would be admitted into the priesthood in 7 years from his baptism and anointing as Messianic King designate......as Daniel 9 foretells; "keeping the covenant in force for a week" (7 years from 29 ce ).

    Weak argumentation can easily be seen only if the sheeple would actually READ the Gospel and THINK about what Jesus is saying. Instead of just being lazy, and letting the elders/GB do all the reading and spiritual 'work'...and they trudge along behind....all the while just having a 'good ol' life'...building, planting, marrying, and getting married....

    And isn't what the majority of us Witnesses did? 'Oh, yeah...well the Apostles and Christ may have went at it hard, but all we are asked to do is go out in service 10 hours a month....along with all these meetings and assemblies, of course.'

    When I heard the GB shut down the ministry school? Say what? Well, there goes the door-to-door work!

    Then I had all the confirmation I needed. In other words, flat-footed admission 'it' (our WT ministry) wasn't working. (Luke 7:35) Now, if it was Jesus' gospel, the appeal of truth, and Biblical veracity would have been recognized, as Christendom; our neighbors who were Christian believers..really didn't hear Jesus' words in our ministry work, did they? Remember?

    How many times was I asked this simple question...that I squirmed under each time?

    "Are you born again?"

    and then...

    "Well, aren't you going to heave to be with Jesus when he returns?"

    "No, I'm going to live on earth in a Paradise!" we said...

    That's when the look came: and you could see the caption cloud above that person's head, thinking:

    ("What Bible are you reading, because that's not what Jesus says in my Bible." and they sometimes would ask to see your Bible...wouldn't they? "New World Translation....huh. I go by the King James Bible myself)

    Whew! Let's change the subject...and quick! We thought...but that didn't end it, because we had to try to explain too many things all at once..."Jesus died on a tree?" "Why do you worship 'Jehovah?' " Don't you love Jesus? " Why don't you celebrate his birth, like Jewish shepherds and angels did that night"...and so on, and so forth.

    It is a HUGE can of worms the WT Society will be opening up if they back off the 'Great Crowd' explanation now.

    It better be brought in with a big can of WD-40 slickness
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2016
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    John S

    John S Member

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    Typo: leave to be with Jesus
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    And Yes, amen , Utuna. It is NOT a really hard thing to deduce the Great Crowd is only those who in all refuse to 'take the Mark of the beast at the end, and see the big anointed/Satanic contest at the end that helps them decide who is the true god.

    Just like Pharoah and the 10 plagues: Egyptians, too, saw and millions no doubt believed, and went into the wilderness through 'Armageddon'...

    "These are the ones that COME OUT of the Great Tribulation"...and have washed their robes in the blood of the Lamb, too. Seeing is believing, and Jesus tells us in Revelation, Jehovah God is going to give a world wide witness to his godship and the truth that Christ is his Son, and these Christians too, are his spirit-filled sons of the Kingdom, at the end. (Rev 11:3-13)
     
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    apocalypse

    apocalypse Guest

    The bottom line. This is another rug pulled out from under the feet of pubs. I hear so many discussions in the corners of the hall. The GB (Goof Balls) are changing everything and fast. This is undermining the faith structure of the pubs. They are drinking more, partying more and doing more of what they want as opposed to what the Goof Balls want.
    Only one thing they are doing less of.
    Contributing.
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    There you go...
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Bottom line, very few agree with you here, and we have strict rules as it pertains to ridicule of Jehovah's Witnesses. Many here are active members and believe the Watchtower is the very courtyard of God, so this is a warning that in this house you must reign in your redirect or jeopardize your membership, and that goes for everyone...

    Our forum charter makes this very clear HERE. Either respect the rules of this house, or go your way.
     
    wallflower, Utuna and Thinking like this.
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    John S

    John S Member

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    Joshua,

    I believe he is speaking truth, don't you? After all he is still attending meetings too, obviously.

    This is exactly what I experienced in Mississippi, after the 1975 failed prophecy occurred. And world-wide it was the same. The 'wall came down'. We went from 275-300,000 baptized that year, down to around a third in the year after, as a consequence; only understandable that a total re-examination was due...as it should have been.

    Look. Now, 36 years after Armageddon was supposed to hit.

    I saw many youth from my congregation fall to drugs, alcoholism, prostitution, even . Gay/homosexuality too. So, these are the results of failed promises , and religion that is not satisfying the rank and file; particularly the targeted youth, who, despite being the ones who are supposed to carry on the work their elders started...are now being criticized for apathy, inactivity, and 'worldly materialism'.

    Well what do the GB expect ? They constantly pressure the flock for money, yet have billions in assets, especially now they are so actively selling real estate, and investing millions and millions in blue-chip stocks.

    You reap what you sow. I imagine many here would agree. 'Pioneering' just doesn't cut it in the real world, especially if you want to have a family. Yet that is what WT says is the 'heritage' of our youth...their 'career'. Do you , personally wish to encourage pioneering as a heritage for JW youth?

    I can't imagine you would, as you prophecy that WT is going to burn down in so in so a year.....

    In reply to your question of me; 'Do I think WT is responsible for my knowledge of the truth?'...I will remind readers that many things WT teaches are on quite a slant away from what Jesus teaches, yet some things are accurate. In the end, I believe Jehovah God uses many Christian religions throughout the last 2000 years to print and preach and make Christian converts. That is why there are a billion Christians in the world, whereas only a small fraction of a percent are JW's still, after they have reached their peak of influence some years ago. But now something changed that WT did not anticipate.

    35 Years ago, the issues of 1975, Great Crowd survivors, and other sheep, were pretty clear to us, as we worked hard to try to single-handedly fulfill the book of Revelation, so God could bring Armageddon. But, nay...we didn't succeed, of course.

    Now, at this time, and even back then, many discerned they were anointed and the scriptures were personally talking to them and so was Jehovah and Christ. The Society quickly tried to put a lid on it....as they do with anyone who dares ask questions. You, here are evidence of it. You have to group together anonymously and in secret to express doctrinal issues with others, and many are like me;resigned, and finally out.

    This man is a JW brother himself; attending meetings, even. You do too, yet you have published many diatribes against WT doctrines. Your timeline prophecies are directly opposing GB WT doctrine. Now you tell another member to tow the line?

    You are the one who stated in the 'What is the temple?' thread.

    I admit, some of the JW's are in the 'courtyard of the Gentiles'. But some are also in the 'Most Holy'...and some JW's may now be in the 'Holy', or heaven itself.

    Do you think that out of all the 2000 plus years of Christianity, only the JW's who are really just a brand new religion comparatively, are the only ones there? No Christians throughout the ages were in the temple? Or that today, ONLY people of the JW religion are worshiping God in the figurative 'temple'?

    Or that only Jehovah's Witnesses , and a mere 8,000 or so, have the spirit-anointing?

    Out of a billion Christians?
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    Apocalypse...brother...do take heart,

    Joshua is speaking no doubt about the GB (goofballs) comment.

    Alot worse has been said or inferred by writers here and moderators. Anyone who prophesies falsely is a 'False Prophet' by any definition of the word. And this term has regulatly been used to descruibe the actions/inactions of WT governance.

    "Goofing around" with all that time and money on their hands, instead of dispensing spirit and truth.

    That really is the subject here many times.

    WT is regularly literally 'weighed in the balances' here ..daily...along with what they are doing and teaching.

    Sobering it is, so we must respectfully view the site like a court hearing before Jehovah the judge; realistically...but in a respectful tone. Some take sides to a certain extent with WT, as they hope God will, in time, remodel it.

    So, now you know.
     
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    jehovahisgod

    jehovahisgod Experienced Member

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    Me I'm quite content to live out what life that Jehovah has granted unto me obeying as best I can Jesus program. And when I die Jehovah can redirect me when he feels like it.

    I won't know any time passage I'm not worried about survival of Armageddon I'm not worried about the great tribulation or the bowels or plagues. I just want to serve as best I can right now and let my mind be free of spiritual technicalities which in my
    Opinion simply detract from my immediate behavior.
     
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    belongingtojah

    belongingtojah Member

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    Well put jehovahisgod and I must say that I agree with John on the subject of how the GB is acting and the obvious presumtuousness to disfellowship as apostates those who trust in Jehovah and Jesus and the word of truth.

    Apocalypse seems to still be in the angry with the governing body stage that most of us have gone through as we realize the importance of not following men. Time will help cool his attitude - but it seems to me to be a mistake to act as the WT does in casting out someone for wanting to speak the truth.

    I do understand the rules of the forum and have enjoyed being able to post here and hear the faith and thoughts of others - perhaps a little understanding and cooperation on the part of all is in order.

    Just some thoughts on this subject.

    As Peter said we were called for a blessing and not a cursing. Jehovah is the judge through Jesus.

    Joe
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    We have rules in this house... I have several active members of Jehovah's Witnesses in our company that are asking for banning of members, and I am trying to find a happy medium for everyone.

    What it comes down to is this; Do you have all knowledge of prophecy? Do you know everything about the Bible? If you don't and make mistakes, does that make you a false prophet and a false religion? We may not agree with the GB's understandings, but again many of us believe that the WTS is and has been used by God, and is considered his very courtyard.

    Therefore there is no reason to try and convince us here of the WTS's mistakes, we all know, but just like we must have respect for each other here, we must also show respect for Jehovah's temple courtyard. Whether you agree with that or not, that is this houses rules.
     
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    John S

    John S Member

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    Joshua.

    I'm sure I am one some would love to see banned. That ...to me, is sad.

    If this is a place of comfort for those seeing questionable actions from the JW hierarchy, then what is the rub? Examine the teachings freely and comment...just as you do...is that OK?

    Are all commenters being asked to get re-instated and believe all the WT teachings over again? That seems to me to be what these ones that are unhappy about want.

    , Most all the ex-JW's served loyally all their lives. Now...they want to be loyal to Jesus Christ and his teachings; which are Jehovah's teachings.

    Are the moderators here in unity on insisting the reader :"Repent and side with WT 's elite Governing Body " as God's sole channel of truth?

    And is that what you believe the GB is , Joshua? I think not from reading your work for over a year now...or Utuna's
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    What we want to foster here is respect, whether that be between you and I, or between us and the GB. It does not matter if the the GB were even enemy's (which they are not) we must love them as our Lord commanded us.

    Therefore we should be praying for the GB, we should be praying for JW's, our brothers and sisters. It doesn't matter if we agree on the GB's interpretation of prophecy, none of us here agree on it either! What is important is we worship the same God!

    No anger is needed between us or them, this is a fundamental teaching of scripture.
     
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    apocalypse

    apocalypse Guest

    Jesus Called the religious leaders of His day "hypocrites". To their face.
    I think goofballs was pretty tame. And it worked well with the acronym.

    But if, like Jesus and they who followed Him in the first century, I need "to be cast out" from the e-jw temple, then so be it.
    But I have company waiting outside. And He has power.

    That said. I will take it down a notch, if that's what will make it good for some.

    I am not, as has been suggested, 'recently angry' which will fade. That would be inaccurate.

    I was such, perhaps 20 years ago, when I began to learn the real truth. But now, I am just zealous. And getting zealouser.
     
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    belongingtojah

    belongingtojah Member

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    Apocalyse,

    Sorry about the angry comment - it just seemed that way by how your post's were worded - I am sure there are others who think the same of me.

    James 3:
    2 For we all stumble many times. If anyone does not stumble in word, this one is a perfect man, able to bridle also [his] whole body.

    Joe
     

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