RUSSIA: Justice Ministry seeks complete Jehovah's Witness ban

Discussion in 'In The News' started by marshroanoke, Mar 16, 2017.

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    marshroanoke

    marshroanoke Member

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    "With no public announcement, Russia's Justice Ministry lodged a suit at the Supreme Court today (15 March) to declare the Jehovah's Witness Administrative Centre "extremist", to liquidate it, and to ban its activity. If successful, this would ban all Jehovah's Witness activity across Russia."

    http://www.forum18.org/archive.php?article_id=2264
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    I wonder how that would translate into websites like ours...
     
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    wallflower

    wallflower Moderator

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    That's a good question.
     
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    Baruq

    Baruq Member

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    Over the past three days, my site has attracted a large number of visitors, and today was the day I had the most new visitors since its inception, as well as the record of visitors (about twice the usual average). Most comes from Google on the page "Moscow Moving for Total Ban on Jehovah’s Witnesses in Russia", which is a text by Robert of last year. I do not know if everything will end well for our Russian brothers, but maybe it's also an opportunity for some JWs to find sites such as these and thus have the opportunity to have an alternative voice to that of the GB.
     
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    marshroanoke

    marshroanoke Member

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    I just had a family member casually suggest that the religion should ask the United Nations for assistance. I was like are you out of your mind? Ask the scarlet beast for help? That would be a deal breaker for me.
     
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    BreakTheWalls

    BreakTheWalls Guest

    I have e-jw and baruq.uk listed on the sidebar of https://reddit.com/r/askajw I wonder how many people are visiting your site, have you noticed an usual spike in the last two months?
     
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    BreakTheWalls

    BreakTheWalls Guest

    They already committed apostasy with United nations, have you read Robert's book?
     
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    Baruq

    Baruq Member

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    Since December, the number of visitors has shot up. I have many visits to my pages in Spanish from South America (but very little from Spain). On the other hand, practically nobody visits the pages in Portuguese. And I have some visitors from Russia.
    When I see the world map of visitors, I feel that I realize the prophecy of Matthew 24:14. (It is a joke, of course)
     
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    99,999% of the members of this forum have read his book and do agree with most of the spiritual aspects that he elaborates therein. It doesn't mean that we all agree with him in everything that he wrote or that he presently thinks (especially regarding his interpretations of the daily breaking news (and especially about his trust in Larouche's statements))...

    Interestingly, the links to his "spiritual e-corpus" as a whole are the only ones freely allowed here on this forum, out of respect for the spiritual depth that the Holy Spirit enabled him to rediscover, which opened wide the spiritual eyes of many of us here...

    Besides that, we're all imperfect (and those of the anointed like Robert too) and are though God's vessels, of some useful kind.... ;)
     
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    Baruq

    Baruq Member

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    Are you sure about 99,999%? It seemed to me that it was 99,9995%.
     
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    marshroanoke

    marshroanoke Member

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    Excellent article by the New York Times

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/04/...itnesses-as-extremist.html?smid=fb-share&_r=0

    It discusses how the extremism law has affected Russian JWs already. Brother Andrei Sivak lost his job as a teacher. Names of JWs are being collected in a national registry. Russian agents are pretending to be JWs and secretly filming meetings (serious shades of the KGB).

    “From the Russian state’s perspective, Jehovah’s Witnesses are completely separate,” said Geraldine Fagan, the author of “Believing in Russia — Religious Policy After Communism.” She added, “They don’t get involved in politics, but this is itself seen as a suspicious political deviation.”

    “The idea of independent and public religious activity that is completely outside the control of — and also indifferent to — the state sets all sorts of alarm bells ringing in the Orthodox Church and the security services,” she said.
     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    For the sake of discussion, what do you find wrong with the Robert-Larouche framework of history?

    Namely, the transition from the post-Roman-nation-state system into the dichotomous "central banking system" iron vs. the democratic "clay"?

    In my reading of history, it seems quite plausibly the interpretation of Daniel 2's final stage.
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    To me the split seems to be Dan 8, and the four horns from the ram. From which you get the battle between the north and south from then on...

    To me the theme in scripture and history seems to be forms of rule. We see a pattern throughout history of a battle between Republic and Oligarch. Since Greece split up, this has been every war up even to the last two world wars.

    I see Democratic rule as just one step before Fascism, and these ones have the banking system on their sides, while the opposite spectrum of this would be a Republic. Keep in mind, it was a Republic form of rule Jehovah set up in Israel, and no doubt is how the heavenly government is arranged.

    This is just my current understanding...

     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    Yes true, thanks for the clarification, I think you're right -- and Daniel 2's "iron and clay" backs up the thesis.

    "“And just as you saw the feet and the toes to be partly of clay of a potter and partly of iron, the kingdom will be divided, but some of the hardness of iron will be in it, just as you saw the iron mixed with soft clay. 42 And as the toes of the feet were partly of iron and partly of clay, so the kingdom will be partly strong and partly fragile. 43 Just as you saw iron mixed with soft clay, they will be mixed with the people;* but they will not stick together, one to the other, just as iron does not mix with clay"

    In a generic sense, it seems the identification is the "post-Roman nation-state system" vs the Greek-democratic philosophy implemented as Republicanism through Rome, which would basically be the Watchtower-Larouche-RobertKing framework.

    This I would argue is the connection between Daniel 7 and 8 - Greek-democratic philosophy transitions into Roman system, which transitions into the iron-clay.

    On that note, I was pondering the "3 horns plucked out"....

    US / UK / France "populism" rejected and defeated by "globalism"?

    If Le Pen wins, that is a possible framework giving us 3 horns, and what seems to be the obvious conclusion of the world that "globalism is good".
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2017
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    I recently have been working on this subject again, and if you saw my whiteboard videos, you would see lots of scribbling. I have come to understand our limitations, and I now have a much more objective understanding of Dan 7 and 8. What I mean by this is, what we do know is the goat and ram represent Medo-Persia and Greece. Beyond that we start to speculate. Such as what I call "one step out" we speculate that the goat represents the bear in 7 and the ram the leopard, but what I call "two steps out" is when we speculate the fourth beast in 7 as Rome. Nothing wrong with this, but it helps to remember to make these claims with the side note of "my opinion".

    So with all of that said, I have resigned myself to explore the prophecies in entirety, so that when there are fulfillment's I would be easily able to connect the dots. I will say at this time however, there seems to be no way around the fact that these prophecies have multiple fulfillment, some two and even three... This includes both Dan 7 and 8.

    In my humble opinion of course... :)

    PS: As example 167 BCE-160 BCE - 66 CE-70 CE - End Times
     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    Indeed, it's all speculation and opinion at this point; But you're objectively wrong! :) :) :)

    Daniel 8 connects 'those kings' with the concluding period of Daniel 7, and there isn't another "mega-beast" like the Roman empire until the Brits. The Arab's after Mohammed ... maybe. But that introduces complications which can't be answered [IMO]
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2017
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    What if Dan 8 connects not only the concluding period, but the Seleucids and 170 CE? So one couldn't say the events represent a single moment, but several...

    Trust me, I know, and speculate myself that the fourth beast of Dan 7 had represented Rome, but what if it also has a representation in the end? What if there is another Rome like beast? What if we shouldn't be looking for a trail of how Rome survived over 2000 years, but a succession of beasts that started again after Rome. Let's say Rome represented the fourth beast, and after it went down, the lion rose again, the beast, leopard, and then finally the fourth rose again, which is alive today in it's new form? Therefore the vision, and the second beast doesn't just represent Rome, but at least two separate entities.

    What if these four beasts also existed before Babylon, Medo-Persia, Greece, Rome? There was Babel, Elam, Assyria.... What if Dan 7 has had several fulfillment's?

    What if the little horn in Dan 8 not only represented the Seleucids in 170CE, but also an entity that comes against Gods people in our time? What does that do to understanding those chapters, when you consider that there are at least two fulfillment's? Maybe the first fulfillment's are a measuring stick to understand the final?

    As always brother, I am so grateful we are should to shoulder waiting for our Lord! Agape...
     

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