(2Th 2) The Restraint & MOL

Discussion in 'Bible Prophecy' started by Joshuastone7, Aug 22, 2013.

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    Joshuastone7

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    Jehovah's word is so beautiful and amazing. The fact that he has kept this book in tact for all these years in almost perfect condition for us today so that we can be a part of sharing it's message in truth is simply beautiful.

    So this brings me to 2Th chapter 2. Reading through this chapter it can be very difficult to determine what the thing is that acts as a restraint, and as well who the MOL is. So in comes the beauty of Jehovah's word, it as always explains itself.

    Let's start with verses 1 and 2 where we are admonished not to give credence to the idea that Jehovah's day had arrived, such as in inspired expressions, letters, verbal messages.

    "However, brothers, respecting the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to him, we request of ​YOU not to be quickly shaken from ​YOUR​ reason nor to be excited either through an inspired expression or through a verbal message or through a letter as though from us, to the effect that the day of Jehovah is here." (2Th 2:1,2)

    Sound familiar? Is this not just what the WTS has been teaching for coming on to 100 years now? Let's read what the bible writer told us to watch out for when this time actually would be upon us.

    "Let no one seduce ​YOU​ in any manner, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction." (2Th 2:3)

    So the day of Jehovah would not begin until first the apostasy comes and then the MOL is revealed. Anyone here familiar with any apostasy in the WTS's recent past? I'm sure you are. Now what of this MOL?

    "He is set in opposition and lifts himself up over everyone who is called “godâ€￾ or an object of reverence, so that he sits down in the temple of The God, publicly showing himself to be a god." (2Th 2:4)

    Now there is an ongoing theory that this MOL could have occured all those years ago back when false teaching would have begun to creep in the early Christian church. We will now show how that theory is impossible and as well show in this chapter where it actually discusses that very issue of false teachings creeping into the early church.

    Number one, we should keep in mind that the 4th verse here says he sits in the temple of "The God". Yes, this MOL does come from within Jehovah's true temple, just as Judas was a close associate of Jesus and had betrayed him.

    Now let's look at the key to understand this entire sequence, and that is the "restraint"!

    "And so now ​YOU​ know the thing that acts as a restraint, with a view to his being revealed in his own due time." (2Th 2:6)

    This scripture says, "now you know the thing that acts as a restraint." Sure previously in this chapter this thing that acts as a restraint is touched on, but as of yet does not give us a clearer picture until we read on of what this restraint is, so let's read verse 7.

    "True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work; but only till he who is right now acting as a restraint gets to be out of the way." (2Th 2:7)

    So we see that at the time this verse was penned the thing that acts as a restraint already existed 2000 years ago. As well notice that this time the verse calls the restraint a "he". Now obviously the "mystery" is that which the restraint brings in, those false teachings infiltrating the early Christian churches. Who is that one who acts as a restraint and brings in those false teachings into the early churches? None other the Satan himself! We will see why this is so in a bit.

    Now, how do we know the MOL cannot have been revealed in any other time but the future? Because sense Satan is that restraint, his being out of the way is his ouster from Heaven! It's not until Satan is casted out of heaven is the MOL revealed. We will look further into this in a bit as well, but let's read on in 2Th.

    "Then, indeed, the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will do away with by the spirit of his mouth and bring to nothing by the manifestation of his presence." (2Th 2:8)

    Now look at the next verse;

    "But the lawless one’s presence is according to the operation of Satan with every powerful work and lying signs and portents."
    (2Th 2:9)

    The operation of Satan is the restraint that backs the lawless one and brings in the apostasy. Now we see the culmination of the 8 verses before it. We have explained here what the restraint is that is behind the lawlessness, and of course it is Satan. That mystery of the lawlessness that had begun to enter the early church those 2000 years ago was the lying signs and portents such as those saying, "The day of Jehovah is here." when in fact Satan was still acting as a restraint and the MOL had not yet been revealed. Remember verse 7? The restraint was acting in place then in the early church, so the bible writer knew he was talking about a future MOL because he says "True, the mystery of this lawlessness is already at work." so he knew there was a future lawlessness that would culminate into the restraint being removed and then MOL being revealed only after Satan's ouster in the future.

    "and with every unrighteous deception for those who are perishing, as a retribution because they did not accept the love of the truth that they might be saved." (2Th 2:10)

    Now look at the next verse;

    "So that is why God lets an operation of error go to them, that they may get to believing the lie, in order that they all may be judged because they did not believe the truth but took pleasure in unrighteousness." (2Th 2:11)

    Here we have it, we now understand what the operation of error is. "The day of Jehovah is here". That's what the operation of error is, and is this not what the society has been saying now for 100 years? The problem with that is just as in the early church the one acting as a restraint, "Satan" has not yet been hurled from heaven, and as well the MOL has not been revealed. So therefore the day of Jehovah and the beginning of the end has not begun!

    It had been a bit of a mystery in chronology exactly when Satan was ousted from heaven. Some tried to tie it to the destruction of the wild beast and fall of the king of the south, but all these ideas were guesses, and now we have it, Rev chapter 12 is chronologically sound from it's description of the very first prophecy in the bible to events just before the flood, on to Jesus faithful course on earth and on down to the end when Jehovah's true temple is trampled on by the nations. The very first occurrence before the MOL is revealed and the end begins is war between Michael and his angles and Satan and his angels when the later are hurled to the earth! Then the MOL is revealed within the temple of "The God" at the first trumpet and that future faithful Rosh Hashana. Jewish-Holidays-Fullfilled

    Your brother
     
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    Thanks Josh, ...you showed me how to lead some one thru those points......I'll use that when the org goes down, and some need help to understand what on earth is going on.........I could use it now..but umm I'm preety sure I will no longer be sis thinking.........just...thinking:rolleyes:
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    I'm with you... :cool: You know Sis, we here are fulfilling prophecy, and into the future will be a part of that work that will bring the "true" knowledge to the world in abundance!

    "But as regards the people who are knowing their God, they will prevail and act effectively. And as regards those having insight among the people, they will impart understanding to the many." (Dan 11:32,33)

    "And the ones having insight will shine like the brightness of the expanse; and those who are bringing the many to righteousness, like the stars to time indefinite, even forever. And as for you, O Daniel, make secret the words and seal up the book, until the time of [the] end. Many will rove about, and the [true] knowledge will become abundant.â€￾ (Dan 12:3,4)

    We do now and will have the privilege into the future of assisting our B&S to come back to Jehovah, what a time to look forward too, and awe inspiring!
     
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    These are some scriptures that I do feel comfortable using now,

    ezekial 9:4

    And Jehovah went on saying to him..Pass thru the midst of the city, thru the midst of Jeruselem, and you must put a Mark on the foreheads of the men that are sighing and groaning over all the detestable things that are being done in the midst of it.

    Its amazing how that is clearly talking about Jehovah's house but we just don't seem to see that until its pointed out to us......and the blindfold begins to slip just a bit.

    Another one which Jehovah in his mercy showed me one night in my time of inactivity and drowning in bitterness and anger was.

    MATHEW 13:24 The kingdom of the heavens has become like a man that sown fine seed in his field. While men were sleeping his enemy came and over sowed weeds in among the wheat and left. When the blade sprouted and produced fruit then the weeds appeared also. So the slaves of the household came up and said to him Master did you not fine sow fine seed in the field. How then does it come to have weeds. He said to them a enemy a man did this. They said to him, do you want us to go and collect them? No! That by no chance while collecting the weeds you uproot the weeds with them. Let both grow UNTIL the harvest season I will tell the reapers. first collect the weeds and bind them to bundles to burn them up. Then go gathering the wheat into my storehouse.
    36: but the weeds are the sons ofthe wicked one and the enemy that sowed them wasthe devil.........

    41.....the son of man will send forth his angels and they will collect out FROM HIS KINGDOM all thiings that cause stumbling and persons who are doing lawlessness.

    This was the first time my blindfold fell and I could not beleive it!.....the weeds were not Christendom as we had always been taught but were right in amongst gods own people......how on earth had I not seen this before.....I was just blown away by this truth...I still remember that night...it was 1:30 in the morning.....it was dark outside and the breeze was rustling the curtains. And I just sat there gobsmaked......I wanted to jump out of my bed and show my very dear friend and sister what ihad found....but I knew she would not be able to handle it.......it was so fustrating not to be able to share this..........it was at this point I knew I had to go back to Gods house.....there was still wheat there and he was allowing this horrible cruel corrupt weed to grow for a little longer.....and I had to be patient.

    It was not long after that I found ewatchman and he also explained those scriptures the same way. As did perimeno and I guess my journey to find the truth about the truth.

    So these are two of my favorite scriptures that I now show to ones that are hurt and inactive or thinking of leaving or just plain dissatisfied with what is going on in Gods house.

    Has anybody got some others they like? Ones we can use without getting disfellowshipped at this point.:D
     
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    Hi Thinking,

    Very nice texts.

    Thanks,
    Barry
     
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    Joshuastone7

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    As I'm sure you know this chapter in Ezekial is prophetic into the time of the end. There are six figures shown with each having their own weapons for smashing. Meaning basically that each would have their own talents and works in Jehovah's word. Not only does it show us the works that we will have in the time of the end, but also the comradery between those who are not as of this writing united. The society is now united, but one day they will not be, and this will be when we will see those "sighing and groaning" and those now of the remnant all seem divided and distant. Although it can be a source of sadness now it gives us hope in the future that Jesus bride will be united as one in a common goal...

    "And, look! there were six men coming from the direction of the upper gate that faces to the north, each one with his weapon for smashing in his hand; and there was one man in among them clothed with linen, with a secretary’s inkhorn at his hips, and they proceeded to come in and stand beside the copper altar."
    (Ez 9:2)



    You know Thinking, this reminds me of the other post I recent started here; Scriptures You Love, in which you responded. At this same time while the weeds and wheat are over sown Jehovah chooses the less over the most, the last over the first in order no flesh might boast!

    “God chose the foolish things of the world, that he might put the wise men to shame; and God chose the weak things of the world, that he might put the strong things to shame; and God chose the ignoble things of the world and the things looked down upon, the things that are not, that he might bring to nothing the things that are, in order that no flesh might boast in the sight of God.â€￾ ​(1Cor 1:27)

    What a beautiful reminder of the work we will all have into the future. To remember that we are nothing but sinners and nothing but slaves of our brothers. We are a tool for Jehovah to get his will, his word to others. Everything we have is for him and from him.




    Ezekial chapter 9 reminds us of a future, a future when all those of the least in Jesus bride class will actually be gathered together as one in a common goal! Not this separation and scattered about. What a day that will be! What a day so different then at present when these ones will be forefront, first in the work of Jehovah. It also shows they will be one in understanding to help bring back Jesus bride to his everlasting kingdom!

    May Jehovah's will take place, his understanding and his will...
     
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    But why six men, also why are they coming from the upper gate face ing the north.....that must mean something.........I get the point each man with his own weapon ....:confused:
     
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    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Here is a section from Wiki.answers.com;

    "Simply stated, "north" refers to the most widely used and easily accessible route in and out of Israel during ancient times. Before there were cars and planes, Israel was primarily accessed on foot. Obviously, there is a great sea (Mediterranean) on the west side of Israel; and there is a vast desert to the east. Therefore, the primary access into (and out of) Israel would have been the passage to the south (from Egypt) and the passage to the north (from Eur-Asia). Thus, biblical references to "north" (when not specifically referencing something that is physically to the north) can be interpreted as meaning "the common access way" or "the most used route".However, "north" can even mean "from above" in certain situations." (Wiki.answers)

    It appears that the prophecies mention of the north gate represents coming into Jehovah's actual temple here on earth, refrence also Ezekial 9:4; “Pass through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and you must put a mark on the foreheads of the men that are sighing and groaning over all the detestable things that are being done in the midst of it." So it would seem that these have the commission to start at the actual headquarters as we see in verse 6; "and from my sanctuary ​YOU​ should start.â€￾ So they started with the old men that were before the house"

    North as well represents these ones from Jehovah themselves. If you notice in the 11th chapter of Daniel verse 44; "But there will be reports that will disturb him, out of the sunrising and out of the north, and he will certainly go forth in a great rage in order to annihilate and to devote many to destruction." This scripture denotes what will occur as the sons and slaves are sealed and their countenances will show like the sun, igniting the 8th king's rage and bringing him against Gods people.

    As for the number of men, given it's randomness without seaming connection to any other source it would appear literal.
     
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    Mmmh
    yes I understand that, thanks for that info.....it's like a jigsaw isn't it...so so much to learn.....prophecy is being played out before our eyes.......( not this bit yet I know)and much more proberly behind doors that we know nothing about.........incredibly exciting.....yet my problem is I'm still too impatient......you know it's great being on this forum because one cannot pick brothers and sisters brains like this in the hall.
    i guess most are just trying to survive this horrible wicked system.....thanks once again:)

    Sis thinking
     
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    Thank you for that:eek:
     
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    Joshuastone7

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    Yea, agreed. I have described scripture like that before. It is a bit like having a very large box of puzzle pieces, but without any picture to go by. Basically you must place each piece up next to every other piece in order to determine without a doubt that those two pieces do not fit together, and to be quite honest I do not believe I would be at my personal understanding of prophecy if it were not for computers. Without computers I do not believe I would have been able to match up each piece in the amount of time I have, or ever. Something also neat is when you get a section of the puzzle together it starts to come together quicker and easier as you begin to see the true image coming through, then at that point the last few pieces just fall in place as they should. Those are those "Ah ha!" moments that make your hair stand up and brings you that ever so closer to our Father...
     
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    Interesting thoughts about the MOL.

    Personally, I don't believe that the GB (or some members thereof) is the MOL although I admit that the reasoning is tenable :

    LAWLESS

    (...)

    The most recent interpretation can be called pastoral catechetical, for the focus is on Paul's pastoral concern for the Thessalonian church (cf. reference in 2 Thess 2:5 to his earlier catechetical instruction). C. Giblin has contended that the "man of lawlessness" is part of the catechetical tradition and is representational rather than denoting a definite historical person. The figure is "entatively variable" (p. 287) — i.e., it can be shaped to address the particular situation with pastoral flexibility. Although there may be historical allusions, they need not be constant. Paul's concern in 2 Thessalonians is to meet the threat to faith presented by the claim that the parousia has already occurred (2:2). According to Giblin, Paul uses the traditional Christian teaching (entatively variable) to refer to a false prophet, the "man of lawlessness" who, as the antithesis of the "man of God" or true prophet, stands as a threat to faith and righteousness. It is the claim of the false prophet that the parousia has already occurred. Paul's pastoral response associates this claim with the Church's tradition about rebellion and then deals with the antecedent conditions for the parousia in such a way as to caution the Thessalonians against either pride or sloth, to encourage them to "stand firm" (v. 15). The time is "not yet": the "man of lawlessness" is yet to be revealed; stand firm. He will be the very embodiment of rebellion (apostasía); stand firm. His doom (as the "son of perdition," v. 3) is sure — but not until he has wreaked much havoc and deception; stand firm.

    This description of the nature and destiny of the "man of lawlessness" is developed in vv. 4 and 8. As the culmination and embodiment of rebellion he opposes God and exalts himself — indeed, he exalts himself to the point of taking God's place, claiming to be God (v.4). He is presently "restrained." (The identity of this restrainer — Gk. katéchon in v. 6, katéchœn in v. 7 — and its/his relation to the "man of lawlessness" is also very conjectural; see RESTRAIN). But the "mystery of lawlessness" is al-ready at work (v. 7): the alienation and rebellion at work in the world are an open secret to the Thessalonians. When "the lawless one" is revealed, he will be vanquished by the Lord; his deceptions will be unveiled and his power destroyed (v. 8). "So then ... stand firm" (v. 15).

    (from International Standard Bible Encyclopedia, revised edition,
    Copyright © 1979 by Wm. B. Eerdmans Publishing Co. All rights reserved.)


    I'm going to have a look at RESTRAIN. If I ever find something interesting, I'll let you know...
     
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    Ok, that one is for Josh ;) :

    2 Thessalonians 2:9-11

    Sha’ul wrote to the Thessalonians, “And now you know what [in v. 7, “whoâ€] is restraining.†They knew, but we don't. According to Ernest Best (The First and Second Epistles to the Thessalonians, pp. 295-302), interpreters have suggested various candidates for the “restrainerâ€: God, the Messiah, the Holy Spirit, the Roman Empire, the preaching of the Gospel, and some force hostile to God. There are arguments against all of these, but the last makes most sense to me, since the phrase, “is out of the way,†can reasonably be applied to the Adversary, Satan, who holds sway in the world now (Ep 6:11-13, 1 Ke 5:8, 1 Yn 5:19) but will be dealt with in the future by God (Revelation 12-13, 20). At that time Satan will send forth the “man who avoids Torah†(vv. 9-11&N). Ernest Best offers this interpretative translation of vv. 6-7:

    “And now you are aware of the hostile occupying power so that the man of rebellion will be revealed at his proper time. For the mystery which is rebellion is already at work; only until the hostile power at present in occupation is out of the way. And then the Rebel will be revealed.â€

    (from Jewish New Testament Commentary Copyright ©
    1992 by David H. Stern. All rights reserved. Used by permission.)

     
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    Utuna

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    Hey Josh,

    What's your take on why Paul uses the neutral in one verse and masculine in another whilst talking about the restrainer ?
     
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    Hog-wash... The article is definitive, just as the correspondence from Paul would have been recognizable and not some 21st century amalgam of some intrinsic metaphor to define Paul's concern, he clearly states his concern without being prevaricate.



    This is exactly the point of Paul's letter, that to show the operation of error. 2Th 2:7 says the mystery of the lawlessness is already at work at that time, and what was that? 2Th 2:2, some were saying the day of "Jehovah was near"! Now what is this all leading to in Paul's letter? 2Th 2:11, this is the "operation of error."

    Again, the MOL is definitive, separate and distinct from Paul's concern for the Thessalonian congregation while in fact speaking of each entity singularly.




    It is a common interpretative practice in Christiandom to separate themselves from prophecy so they wont have to deal with it. If one is to simply state that all prophecy is a metaphor for how we should live, that releases the responsibility to bring fulfillment to our modern world. But make no mistake, prophecy is written for the end times, and for those he has chosen to usher in this new world and bring truth to those who will listen. (Dan 11:33) The evidence is that there were those actually in Paul's day claiming the parousia had begun, this statement by Paul was never intended to be some hidden moral reminder. Give me a break...



    Again, to imply some 21st century cop out in order to assume that the MOL represents sin itself is to smother a match with a fire engine. Ive actually read this interpretation and many more, and as you learn to see that Paul was simply reminding them of a conversation he had with them previously you realize that he wasn't creating some hidden message to tell them to not sin, this is a clear prophecy for the time of the end, and watering it down will in no way keep Jehovah from his time table...
     
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    It's quite simple. The masculine shows the definite article. The neutral in that of their actions. The restrainer keeps in place the operation of error, in that of the false parousia.

    This is the whole point of Paul's letter. The day of Jehovah would not begin until first the MOL was revealed. He has not been revealed, therefore the day of Jehovah is not here. It is said he "sits in the temple of The God." It's quite simple what the Thessalonians would have associated with this statement, the temple in Jerusalem and the center of spiritual worship.

    As for the MOL, we have another simple example, Judas...

    There is an old acronym I like to keep in mind, K.I.S.S., meaning Keep it simple stupid... Jehovah's word does not need us to understand it. It does not need interpretation or explanation, it quite simply explains itself without the need for a modern theological society to impose it's broad generalities in order to reduce ever passing prophecy to a moral reminder to keep from sin...
     
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    Utuna

    Utuna Administrator

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    That's more or less the answer I expected. The neutral is for the actions and the masculine for the character.

    I usually distrust what is simple... especially when it comes to biblical matters. Jehovah will reveal the proper keys in due time.

    The jury is still out... ;)
     
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    Actually it's not "keys" we're looking for, it's the MOL that will be "revealed in due time", is it not? :p
     
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    Utuna

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    Well, it depends on what's meant by the word "revealed", I guess.
     
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    Well, then you can go to chronology and see what other events are to occur at this same moment in order to understand this being revealed and we find those here;

    "And he will actually go back and hurl denunciations against the holy covenant and act effectively; and he will have to go back and will give consideration to those leaving the holy covenant."
    (Dan 11:30b)

    "And it kept getting greater all the way to the army of the heavens, so that it caused some of the army and some of the stars to fall to the earth, and it went trampling them down." (Dan 8:10)

    re·veal [ri-veel]
    verb (used with object)1.to make known; disclose; divulge: to reveal a secret.
    2.to lay open to view; display; exhibit.
    3.an act or instance of revealing; revelation; disclosure.
     

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