Faith, Fear and Prayer

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by RR144, Nov 19, 2020.

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    RR144

    RR144 New Member

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    The conflict between faith and doubt is the great reality of the time in which we live. Never before in human history has so much tragedy been witnessed in such vivid display to so many. News events are transmitted via cell phones worldwide as they happen — hurricanes, earthquakes, famine, sickness, murder, terrorism, and every imaginable evil. Even more disheartening are news reports filled with the hypocrisy of those who were supposed to be pillars of the community—faithful shepherds of the church. Their crimes against the innocent have now been exposed and add an even greater burden to the weak in faith. At times like these, doubt can plague even the most earnest Christian. Knowing what God is doing in the earth in preparation for His Kingdom is critical to dispelling fear. A Christian's faith must be built upon a solid foundation of truth in order to survive the storms of life. The Scriptures are filled with prophecies which provide the necessary information a Christian needs to be prepared for the time in which he lives.

    To those who have fully given their hearts to God and who have accepted Christ as their advocate, there is an open invitation to approach the Heavenly Father in prayer for needed grace and help. There is no need of an earthly intermediary—Christ alone is our advocate. But, praying to the Heavenly Father is not a privilege to be taken lightly. The early disciples of Jesus inquired: “Lord, teach us to pray.” (Luke 11:2) This was an appropriate question, as all followers of Christ should learn that there is a certain manner in which to approach the King of the Universe. Jesus responded: “After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.” (Matthew 6:9) Only those who have given their heart to God have the privilege of calling Him Father, and such have the assurance that God has the affection and watch-care of a true father for his child. (See also Romans 8:13-17) But the manner of approach to our Father is one of supreme reverence—“Hallowed be thy name.” Some make the mistake of bringing God down to their level, but the Scriptures are very clear that “the reverence of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.” Psalm 111:10 NAS

    Lord bless,

    RR
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Thank you for your commentary RR. The world is changing, and it isn't getting any easier for those on the fringe.

    May Jehovah's will be done...
     
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    ExLuther New Member

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    Thank you RR, your opening comments about the abundance of violence and terror and despair that we are exposed to is a very astute point. I am in probably one of the last generations who came into adulthood WITHOUT social media; I have a sister 8 years younger than I am whose teen years and early adulthood were FAR different than mine. I think that the presence of the internet has certainly accelerated the events of the last days, or at least made them seem to move faster. Never before have we been exposed to so much information, good AND bad, and I believe it is very overwhelming for our human brains. Emotional and mental struggles are rampant in my sister's generation in a way that I've never experienced. I think this is important to keep in mind when considering how to witness to people in these tough times.
     
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    RR144 New Member

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    I can relate Ex. I didn't grow up with the internet either, my kids did. I have 2 step kids as my wife is 14 years younger than me, and they walk around like their on a reality show. iPad and phones stuck to their hands. When they stay with us, I rarely see them except for dinner time, and even then they have their iPads with them, they go to the bathroom with them. I've always said if our enemies wanted to conquer us all they have to do is turn off the WIFI. In fact every so often when I need to know if they're alive ... I turn off the WIFI and within second they jump out of their rooms "What happened to the WIFI?". I look at my wife and remind her that we're doomed if they're the future.

    Lord bless!

    RR
     
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    Tsaphah

    Tsaphah Experienced Member

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    I had to laugh at your comment about the kids having those IPads, and phones. My wife and I took a plane trip to visit my aunt. While sitting in the lobby, we were watching three kids sitting with their parents. They each had a phone, and were apparently talking to each other, texting. They would look at each other, then text a message. Take a look, then text.We both thought. "What's this world coming to?":eek:

    My wife was having trouble getting the e-phone, she got as a gift, to work. Our 5 year old great grand son told my wife, “Gram-ma, I can show you how it works. Let me see it.” She started laughing. He took the phone from her and started explaining all the screens, etc. She still hates it. I have to keep her from throwing it against the wall. Our main phone is still a land line.

    I know what you are saying about the WIFI issue. My 9 year old great grand daughter asked me for my internet password, so she could access the internet. Ha ha ha, NO WAY!!:rolleyes:

    Regarding the situations going on around the world is; it’s getting worse. It seems as nothing is surprising any more. The only thing I can compare it to is 1968. We lived in the San Francisco Bay area, near Berkeley. I had a friend that was in the Armed Forces with me. He also had moved to the “Bay Area”, and became friends with some of the leaders of the Black Panthers. We “hung out” together at the University of California. There were quite a few confrontations with the Oakland Police. One of the big news items was what was known as the “Peoples Park” incident. They brought in the National Guard to quell the riots.

    Then, there was the assassination of Martin Luther King, Robert Kennedy, etc. I believe that’s when things began to really change. Little subtle changes; almost undetectable. It’s been growing ever sense. It reminds me of a scene from an old Three Stooges movie. “Slowly I turned, step by step, inch by inch, GOTCH YA!
    https://www.google.com/search?q=step+by+step,+inch+by+inch&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1#kpvalbx=__Vi4X9vhLumt0PEP8e2R8A411

    I live in central California, nicknamed the “Valley of the Jolly; Ho Ho Ho, Green Giant! It is officially the Sacramento Valley. It is one of the creations, of the Flood of Noah’s day. It’s about 200 miles long and 50 miles wide.
     
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    Tsaphah

    Tsaphah Experienced Member

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    I believe that I am being taught by Christ Jesus and His Father, Jehovah God. My favorite aunt recently came to an end or her life; here on our planet earth. She had my daughters at her bedside when she went to sleep. She had instructed my daughters to give me all her Bibles, books and booklets. I have been reading two of them about prayer, how to pray, when to pray, and how to “pray the word”.

    Recently, I had a desire to learn how to pray, and why it was necessary. My prayers were answered! It falls under the heading: When you feel overwhelmed with too much to do. Here is a short one for everyone. “Come to Me, all you who labor and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. Take My yoke upon you and learn from Me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For My yoke is easy and My burden is light.” ( Mt 11:28-30, NKJV )
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Amen...
     
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    Tsaphah

    Tsaphah Experienced Member

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    I was recently given all of my late aunt's Bibles, study books. etc. Inside one of the Bibles, was this poem, hand written by a friend of hers.
    I would like to share with everyone. It makes us think of Who We Are.

    The Man in the Glass

    When you get what you want in your struggles for self
    And the world makes you king for a day,
    Just go to a mirror and look at yourself
    And see what that man has to say.

    For it isn't your father or mother or wife
    Whose judgment upon you must pass,
    The fellow whose verdict counts most in your life
    Is the one staring back from the glass.

    Some people might think you're a straight shooting chum
    And call you a wonderful guy.
    But the man in the glass says you're only a bum
    If you can't look him straight in the eye.

    He's the fellow to please, never mind all the rest
    For he's with you clear to the end
    And you've passed your most dangerous test
    If the guy in the glass is your friend.

    You may fool the whole world down the pathway of years
    And get pats on the back as you pass
    But your final reward will be heartache and tears
    If you've cheated the man in the glass.

    Peter Dale Wimbrow, usually known as Dale Wimbrow,
    (June 6, 1895 – January 26, 1954) was an American composer,
    radio artist and writer. He is best known for the poem,
    The Guy in the Glass, written in 1934.
     
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    Tsaphah

    Tsaphah Experienced Member

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    I have just read e-Watchman’s article titled “Will Christianity Survive the End of the World?
    One of the first questions I had was about this statement; “The second stage of the divine purpose is to gather and prepare a family of believers to stay on earth after the end of this wicked world in order to re-inhabit the earth and physically transform it into paradise. Indeed, God’s everlasting Word assures the believer that the meek will inherit the earth and reside forever upon it.”

    My question is: How many humans will that be? Today, the existing number in 2020 is approximately 7.8 Billion according to the most recent United Nations estimates elaborated by Worldometer. The term “World Population” refers to the human population ( the total number of humans currently living ) of the world. ( This term world is speaking of the planet Earth.)

    Is this number sustainable? A 2012 UN report summarized 65 different estimated maximum sustainable population sizes. “The most common estimate was eight billion, a little larger than the current population. But the estimates ranged from as few as two billion to, in one study, a staggering 1,024 billion. Mar 14, 2016.”

    What has the human population done to planet Earth? Take a look at a picture of planet earth from space. How many cities have been built? Look for a picture taken at night and see how much of the earth is visible light? This light is from cities and other human presence. What have the cities of mankind done to planet earth? The answer is: Mainly covered over and removed plant and animal life.

    Jehovah God told the survivors of Noah’s Flood; “So God blessed Noah and his sons, and said to them: “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth.” ( Gen 9:1 NKJV ) What did they do? “And they said, “Come, let us build ourselves a city, and a tower whose top is in the heavens; let us make a name for ourselves, lest we be scattered abroad over the face of the whole earth.” ( Gen 11:4 NKJV )

    Supposedly, the “family of believers” who survive and “re-inhabit the earth and physically transform it into paradise”, will not over populate the earth. They will also not build big cities that replace vegetation and other animals. I served in northern Alaska, above the “Arctic Circle” for 18 months. I am appalled at what man is doing to the environment up there. Not only are they ruining the northern
    environment, they are killing the animals that depend on the land and water, and live there.

    Poor Santa, will have to trade in his sleigh for an RV. That’s because there will be no more rain-deer, and rain-deer don’t live forever.:eek:
     
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    RR144

    RR144 New Member

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    I never bought into the whole "only Jehovah's Witnesses will survive Armageddon and populate the earth" belief system. I just couldn't see a God of love destroy the masses because they didn't respond to a knock on the door. 1 Timothy 4:10 tells us that God provided salvation for ALL men. 1 Timothy 2:3,4 states that God “will have ALL men to be saved and to come unto the knowledge [Greek, accurate knowledge] of the truth.” This is a salvation that comes before knowledge. Jesus’ ransom for ALL (verse 6) guarantees that ALL who died in Adam will be saved from Adamic death. That is ALL, not called to be of the church, will be awakened from the sleep of death and given an accurate knowledge of the truth. This is the “evil” class of John 5:28,29, which comes forth from the grave to a “resurrection of krisis” or trial.

    In the Kingdom, Jesus and his church will embark upon the greatest educational program in history. Isaiah 11:9 states, “’for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea.” Also Jeremiah 31:34 says, “…for they shall ALL know me from the least of them unto the greatest.” Verses 29 and 30 show that for the majority, the Kingdom will provide the first full, fair opportunity for salvation. “In those days they shall say no more, the fathers have eaten a sour grape and the children’s teeth are set on edge. But everyone shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.”

    When people come forth from the grave in the Kingdom, they will be informed that they have been purchased with the precious blood of Christ and they will be made aware of the fact that they are now under the reign of Jesus Christ and his church (1 Corinthians 6:2). Because “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten son” for them (John 3:16) The majority of humanity will gladly receive the instruction, the disciplining and the nurturing necessary to pass their trial for eternal life. This plan is the great “restitution” (restoration) project foretold by all the Old Testament prophets (Acts Page 9 3:20,21).

    RR
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    I remember the first time I saw a Watchtower, I was 15. It was on the paradise new earth. The pictures in it showed a beautiful landscape with dotted homes among the hills and wild life all around. I was astonished and couldn't even finish the article before having a great desire to show it to everyone in the house. "HEY DID YOU SEE THIS!" Regardless of the Watchtower's failures, that's what I think about when I imagine that future world...

    RR, I personally don't agree every person who ever lived will be resurrected, for while I believe our Lord died for all, I believe that to be all that are deserving of a resurrection at death. Whether that be those who never had an opportunity to learn and are a law in their own hearts, or true believers. But no doubt some have committed that unforgivable sin, blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Otherwise our Lord wouldn't even have mentioned it. "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven." Mth 7:21

    Anyway, it doesn't matter, this is only my opinion. We're just here passing time with these discussions until we find out for real! ;)
     
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    RR144 New Member

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    We need to differentiate between the Church class (the spirit-begotten) and the world of mankind. The scriptures ARE clear that in Matthew 12:31 that "every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men." This applies ONLY to the spirit-begotten, as only they have the Holy Spirit. In other words, you can't sin against something you've never had. So yes, those of the Church class who sin against the Spirit will go into second death. But world of mankind, those who have not been called and accepted to run the "race of the high calling" (Phil. 3:14) will enter the Kingdom reign of Christ.

    That said, it doesn't necessarily mean that everyone will enter the Kingdom, but that they will have the opportunity to enter said Kingdom if they are faithful during the Millennial Reign.

    RR
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    I understand what you're saying, but there are a few scriptures I'd like your response on please.

    As we see here simply not believing means some will not enter God's rest. That means they never had God's spirit to begin with.

    "And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed? So we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief."
    Heb 3:18

    Then we have many instances of individuals who would not enter God's rest. These scriptures are saying it was decided during their lives they would not enter God's rest.

    "Now we who have believed enter that rest, just as God has said, "So I declared on oath in my anger, 'They shall never enter my rest.'" And yet his works have been finished since the creation of the world." Heb 4:3

    "Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it." Heb 4:1

    "Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience." Heb 4:11

    "And to whom did God swear that they would never enter his rest if not to those who disobeyed?" Heb 3:18

    "For somewhere he has spoken about the seventh day in these words: “On the seventh day God rested from all his works.” And again in the passage above he says, “They shall never enter my rest.” Therefore since it still remains for some to enter that rest, and since those who formerly had the good news proclaimed to them did not go in because of their disobedience," Heb 4:4-6

    -----------

    "For forty years I was angry with that generation; I said, ‘They are a people whose hearts go astray, and they have not known my ways.’ So I declared on oath in my anger, ‘They shall never enter my rest.’" Psm 95:10,11

    I'm sorry, but it makes no sense to have God intervene during these last 6000 years if everyone was going to enter the 1000 year kingdom. Why have any rules in this world at all? If you're saying Moses, as well as Hitler, will both be resurrected into the new world, then that makes everything in our current lives meaningless, and we could do whatever our flesh desired.

    As you know brother, not even all those saying "Lord Lord" will enter his kingdom; only the ones doing his will. And I don't think we can just say these scriptures are only talking about the anointed, these were the same rules the Jews had...

    We may just have to agree to disagree on this one... :)
     
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    RR144 New Member

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    All these verses have to do with the Israelites in the wilderness. Because of their unfaithfulness, their unbelief in Jehovah's promises they were not permitted to enter into the promise land. That first generation perished in the wilderness. Keep in mind that the Hebrews were God's chosen people. "For you are a holy people to the LORD your God, and the LORD has chosen you to be a people for Himself, a special treasure above all the peoples who are on the face of the earth." (Due. 7:6-11; 14:12; 26:18;

    Today we have Spiritual Israel, they too are "a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, His own special people, that you may proclaim the praises of Him who called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; who once were not a people but are now the people of God, who had not obtained mercy but now have obtained mercy." (1 Peter 2:9-10)

    With regard to those who ask, "Lord, Lord, have we not done this, and have we not done that in thy name?" this applies to some whom the Lord looked upon favorably at one time in their life, and then they did something, or a number of things, that were irreconcilable. From that point on, everything praiseworthy that was done previously (as shown in the type of the Nazarite vow in the Old Testament) is forgotten and no longer considered by the Lord as merits toward making the Little Flock. Such individuals might have their past deeds in mind when they express this surprised attitude. They did do wonderful works and they were blessed, but then came a point of testing where they failed and refused to repent. From that point on, they lost out on the Little Flock.

    RR












    Aa


    [​IMG]

    Rolando Rodriguez
    Active Now
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    You are mistaken RR, with all due respect... :)

    Paul was speaking about a future rest when quoting Exodus. He was stating not everyone would enter a future rest.

    "Therefore, since the promise of entering his rest still stands, let us be careful that none of you be found to have fallen short of it." Heb 4:1

    Clearly, Paul is saying Jehovah was speaking about a future rest in his new kingdom when speaking to the Israelites in the wilderness, and not just Cannan. Cannan was a metaphor for the rest, not the actual rest; Paul makes this very clear when stating it is still future. Otherwise, how is it Paul and everyone after including us are to enter that same rest (Cannan) as the Israelites 3500 years ago? I'm not interested in moving to the middle east...

    "Let us, therefore, make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will perish by following their example of disobedience." Heb 4:11

    The 'rest' or Cannan was a metaphor for that new world to come. Just as some would not enter his rest after the Exodus, so too some will not enter his future rest according to Paul. This also includes countless humans before Jesus' sacrifice.

    You can't explain Paul's words away as being only to those who receive the spirit, because you would have to include every single person who has lived these last 2000 years.

    The Bible is full of information telling us who will not enter God's kingdom. I'm sorry but your explanation is a clear case of applying scripture to doctrine. This explanation renders the Holy Spirit meaningless toward earth bound individuals, and sorry, I would never except that.

    You cannot just apply prophecies to the earthly or heavenly classes as one's doctrine needs. This is how the Trinity is explained. The Bible has a single cohesive narrative that one must honor in reading it...

    The Bible overwhelmingly teaches that God chose some sinners for salvation, apart from any merit of their own, passing by other sinners.

    Also, if Jesus made atonement for those who do not believe and are condemned, then God has unjustly punished sin twice, once at Jesus' sacrifice, and again in the damnation of sinners who do not believe. No, individuals make this choice in life. It is up to them to make use of Christ's sacrifice... You take away free will and choice. You say any non-believer who does not wish to serve God will be resurrected to his kingdom? That is not free will. I've known more then one person who would not wish to live forever, regardless of the circumstances. Our Lord resurrects these people anyway, against their will?

    I understand what you're saying, but you apply all New Testament spiritual direction only to the heavenly class. You must see the error in that... Otherwise, you are saying if you're not heavenly bound you can do whatever you want in this life and still enter that rest. Sorry brother, nah...

    "Just as the Son of man came, not to be ministered to, but to minister and to give his life as a ransom in exchange for many.” Mth 20:28

    It's said well here: "General redemption is not scripturally tenable for the Bible clearly teaches particular redemption, also known as limited atonement. Christ’s atoning work is not limited in its power or value—indeed it saves us to the uttermost—but it is limited in scope to those who belong to Christ and who therefore trust in him. Jesus’ death is sufficient for all the world but efficient only for a few."

    You've fallen into a single word trap, "ALL." A single brush stroke does not describe a painting, we must take a step back in order to grasp the whole work...
     
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    RR144 New Member

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    You know Josh, I had a long drawn out response but then decided against posting it. Let's just say that I believe in "rightly dividing the truth", I'm sure you do too. But as the scriptures speak to me, it is evident to me, with a proper understanding of the ransom doctrine, that every, man, woman and child who ever lived, will be resurrected. That's not to say that they will all enter into the Kingdom everlasting, but that will have that opportunity during the millennial reign, after all that's what the millennial reign is for.

    God is calling at this time a royal priesthood, those who will reign with Jesus. Only those who have accepted this invitation are under the second death, because they have been anointed with the Spirit. God is only dealing with them, He will then deal with the rest of mankind later. But we can agree to disagree and move on.

    Lord bless!

    RR
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    "One person esteems one day as better than another, while another esteems all days alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind." Rom 14;5

    Peace be with you brother... :)
     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    I tend to agree, everyone is going to be resurrected and have the "veil" lifted so we can go through Adam's experience.

    This is Jehovah's will, that all people be saved, and the millennial reign of Christ's righteous kingdom is the basis for judgment.

    We do know that those who take the mark of that final digit-based economic system in Rev. 13 seem to be doomed as "not written in the book of life", but considering how little the Pharisees (like us, studying God's word) of Jesus day actually understood what they studied for those 1000 years from David to Jesus, I'm inclined to not have a strong opinion either way and just let Jesus work out the details :)

    Therefore side with hope, love, optimism, forgiveness, patience, kindness and faith.
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    Hey brother... :)

    I don't know if we ever discussed it before, but have you ever considered the mark of the beast involves spiritual apostasy?

    The reason I mention it is because Jesus says to 'buy' from him in chapter 3.

    "I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see." Rev 3:18

    Compare that to Rev 13;

    "It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their right hands or on their foreheads, so that they could not buy or sell unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name." Rev 13:16,17

    I think it's interesting we also have the mark of the beast applied to the apostasy of Solomon when he broke Jehovah's command not to collect an abundance of Gold.

    "Now the weight of gold that came to Solomon in one year was 666 talents of gold." 1Kgs 10:14

    As well we also have an example of this same number involved in apostasy in Daniel 3.

    "King Nebuchadnezzar made an image of gold, sixty cubits high and six cubits wide, and set it up on the plain of Dura in the province of Babylon." Dan 3:1

    That would have made the monument 60x6x6, not unlike the Washington monument measuring 555x55x55.

    There are also some interesting correlations between the golden calf in the wilderness to Rev 13 as well...

    I just didn't know if we had discussed these and if you had ever given it consideration...

    All love...
     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    We discussed this in detail!

    "It puts under compulsion all people—the small and the great, the rich and the poor, the free and the slaves"

    Notice the "sell" activity is also a component of this. It's not purely buying.

    Perhaps there are two applications, but the primary point seems be that the 8th king will force mankind to choose between what will be the revealed sons of God, and the human empire "8th king's" world.

    I certainly sympathize with a hyper-abstract reading of the scriptures! But in this case, I find the direct application fits like a puzzle with all of the other prophecies about the conclusion.

    On top of which, we now see what this digit-based system will be: cryptocurrency

    Jesus may well have been talking about this event when suggesting we "buy from him" rather than siding with the test of this final event that the Northerner forces on the planet. But the rich and the poor won't be able to sell anything either, compare with Habbakuk where the Northerner destroys the global economy in a grand theft.
     

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