Genesis 3:15

Discussion in 'General Discussions' started by Domenic, May 16, 2015.

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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    Sure, no skin off my back!

    I am curious to read these scrolls though, I devour ancient literature, primarily to refute it's claims :)

    Like Enuma Elish, Book of the Dead, etc. -- particularly the Horus - Osiris argument, or the Archon nonsense coming out of Sumeria and espoused by the high priests of today like Jim Marrs.

    So please, lay it on me man, let's put a candle to these babies!
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    The only people Jehovah ordered killed were those not of Adams seed.(sperm.) Again it goes back to the two seeds. (sperm.)
     
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    SingleCell

    SingleCell Experienced Member

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    Doesn't that make Jehovah's judgment external and capricious?

    If DNA is the factor in the worthiness of a sentient being, then we have a major problem with our perspective of who God is.

    It seems to me that Jehovah explained exactly why the Jebusites, et al, were judged: they were passing their children through the fire, having orgy religious parties, and raping-pillaging the weak.

    Sorry, I'm not trying to argue with you, but you are making claims that ... if wrong, set you up for failure and enmity with God (falling prey to teachings of Demons).

    And if you're correct, make Jehovah unworthy of worship, because his judgment is predicated on physical attributes (DNA, etc).
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest


    This is how I see my just God Jehovah: He is a giver, and taker of life. If there are any who do not want to serve him as he wants, he takes life away. If you had a job, and being paid to do the job as the boss wants you to, he would fire you if you refused to do what he was paying you to do. Simple. We are created to serve our God. He would have no need of us if we refuse to do it his way.
    He is a giver, and taker of life:

    New International Version
    "The LORD brings death and makes alive; he brings down to the grave and raises up.

    New Living Translation
    The LORD gives both death and life; he brings some down to the grave but raises others up.

    English Standard Version
    The LORD kills and brings to life; he brings down to Sheol and raises up.

    New American Standard Bible
    "The LORD kills and makes alive; He brings down to Sheol and raises up.

    King James Bible
    The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave, and bringeth up.

    Holman Christian Standard Bible
    The LORD brings death and gives life; He sends some to Sheol, and He raises others up.

    International Standard Version
    The LORD kills and gives life, he brings people down to where the dead are and he raises them up.
     
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    SingleCell

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    I guess my question is: how do you square the 'taking of life' predicated on genetics with a God worth worshiping?

    If God decided to kill all left-handed people, because Satan was left-handed, would you still worship him? Isn't DNA the same thing as being left-handed? (Nephilim are a different subject)

    Consider Psalm 138:2b:

    I will praise your name Because of your loyal love and your faithfulness.


    Certainly there is no darkness in Jehovah, he is perfect. We are pond scum.

    But if he were killing people capriciously because of their genetics, I'm not sure how I would feel. So I'm curious about the 'why' question of worshiping the version of God you believe in?

    [presuming you are saying that God kills people based on the amino-acids in their DNA, rather than spiritual qualities of righteousness and justice]

    You seem to be defining 'wickedness' as a sequence of amino-acids, rather than the free-will choice to reject Jehovah and his perfect law.
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    I understand what you are saying. The Nephilim were not created by Jehovah. The angels came to earth and took on human form. Their sperm mixed with human women produced a creature Jehovah did not create. This was a different seed...and they were not good loving creatures of Jehovah...he killed these at the flood, but the seed did have a ticket on the ark...Noah's wife. That seed is still here today, and they are not lovers of God. Their DNA is not of the DNA Jehovah created...these he had his people kill. This is what Jesus spoke about when he told his followers about the wheat, and the tares...the tares are what we call Satan's seed.

    Let me ask you this: When Jesus takes rule, what would the world be like if the tares were allowed to also be there? Would the world be any different than it is now? I don't think so. The stuff those angels did before the flood was bad...very bad. their off springs were eating the humans. Look into this. It is a proven fact, man and the dinosaurs were here at the same time. That has been proven over, and over. it has also been proven the dinosaurs died at the flood. God did not created the dinosaurs. if he had, they would have been on the ark.
    if you want to start a thread on dinosaurs, I will be more than happy to post what I know to be true.
     
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    SingleCell

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    You might be right about some of the basics, I don't mean to completely dismiss some of this, I've often wondered about the Rephaim, etc!

    [but there are a lot of solid debunks as well]
     
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    Utuna

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    We've talked ad nauseam and for years about the dinosaurs here on this db or elsewhere.... Please...! You might have unexpected friends for you around here on this db if you ever broach that subject, like Adam hunting the T-Rex, for example.... and making cowboy boots with dinosaur skin.... :p

    I know some people who can prove it ! ;)
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    Well, when Jehovah created the animals, he could not have created the dinosaurs before he created the animals? The dino's were not good creatures. Nothing struck the earth to take them out. If God created them, Noah would have had them on the ark. Enoch says the angels who came to earth mixed animals, and created these things. It's like with dogs. you can mix types of dogs, and get some very bad dogs. ...Pitt Bulls for one.

    As you have suggested: If you believe God created the dinosaurs, we can agree to disagree.
     
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    SingleCell

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    An interesting perspective!

    What about this scripture?

    "Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made." - John 1:3

    Who knows ...
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    So then let me give you something to think about;

    Do you know you leave spiritual matters all up to interpretation? You are saying one must decide if the Gospel of Judas matches the scrolls or not in order to determine if it is valid. Well, if you don't know, the Gospel of Judas matches every account in the new testament about the life of Christ Jesus, in every detail but one, that Judas was the only true disciple of Christ, and the others were never part of Jesus's plan. So, will you say that the Gospel of Judas is more accurate because it was left out of the official Bible? After all you did say that sinful man wanted to leave out truths (such as according to you the book of Enoch), so therefore you should believe the Gospel of Judas is a more accurate account of Jesus's faithfulness because number one it was left out of the Bible, two, it matches the history of the Bible, and three, it's age puts it in the time of the rest of the cannon... So according to your criteria, you should believe the Gospel of Judas is a more accurate rendition of events pertaining to Jesus. Right?

    This would be the logical conclusion. It matches all the other scrolls as it pertains to history, people, places, but only the hero has changed, Judas...

    Then of course you can't forget the Gospel of Mary, Jesus had a wife according to those fragments. Again, the names are right, the dates of the papyri, but they contradict the Bible. So????

    You have said all religions are false, I challenge that idea. Jehovah always had a people on earth that had accurate knowledge of him, and we know from many scriptures there are people on earth today that do have accurate knowledge. The Bible tells us that God always had a people on earth.... Period.

    I think you underestimate Jehovah's ability, his ability to present us a collection of books in a single form, and his ability to have the truth of that book present in our day. (In my opinion)

    I just happen to believe he's capable of that...
     
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    Joshuastone7

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    Let me get this straight, you believe that before the flood mankind could manipulate the genetic code in animals in such a way that they could create completely new species outside the normal genetic sequencing that relies on sexual reproduction?

    Now let me just remind everyone for a moment that this isn't possible today with our state of the art facilities, our cryogenics, DNA mapping, sequencing, atom smashers, as well as the endless breeding experiments. The most we can get is a dog with different shapes and colors, and whats sad to me is you use the example of micro evolution to try and prove your point. Surely you know the difference between micro, and macro evolution?

    Let me just leave this post with this, you have just there suggested that before the flood mankind was capable of something we are not capable of today...

    What say you?
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    I like John 1:3. It was true when it was written, it is true today, and will be true tell the end of time.

    Jehovah created angels. Jehovah created man, and women. The angels took women, and mixed what Jehovah created, and had something that never should have been.
    Men take metal Jehovah created, and shaped the metal into tanks of war. Did Jehovah create tanks? the world is full blind babies, deformed babies. Did Jehovah create deformed babies? No. The mixing of what Jehovah created made things that should not be.
    The command was, "Eat from every tree(human sperma) of the garden, but not from the tree of the knowledge of right, and wrong (Non-human sperma.)"
    many have asked, "Where did Cain get his wife?" When humans were perfect, the could mate with all other humans, brothers, sisters, etc.
    The more the human seed (Sperma) mixed with that of the angels, the less perfect was the seed (sperma) Jehovah had created. today we are fare from having perfect seed(sperma). We cannot mate with sisters, or brothers.

    Yes I believe in John 1:3
     
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    Domenic Guest

    You claim to believe in the scriptures. I believe you do. Genesis says angels came to earth, and took on the forms of men...The angels must have great power to change from spirit forms to human like forms? Jehovah did not change them to human form. They must know something about DNA that man does not? Some believe man is very smart. I do not. Man was designed to be the care taker of the earth...we don't have to be very smart for that position. It is Satan, and the angels who followed him that has given man all these things of wonder. Enoch recorded the wonders the angels gave to man. Satan is still giving things to man. In 1914 man was riding a horse. Within 60 years he was riding a car on the moon. Do you think maybe something is wrong there? You see I believe we are not very smart creatures. Like I have posted, I can not even take one breath without Jehovah. I can do anything with him, nothing without him. Do you think it was Jehovah who gave us the atomic bomb?
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    There's a difference between manifesting physical bodies, and creating a modern lab to create cross species creatures beyond what we have today, give me a brake.

    You either create creatures as beings outside our universe as all creatures were, or you cross breed them, which are you saying occurred?
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    For once I would like to hear what you believe?
     
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    Joshuastone7

    Joshuastone7 Administrator Staff Member

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    You made a statement that dinosaurs were bad. What does that mean, bad how? Lions eat meat, tigers, bears.

    The simplest understanding is that the land animals were created all on the 6th creative day, and each creative day was the same length, 7000 years.

    This is the simplest understanding without imposing any personal belief into the subject. Nothing about that understanding can be said comes from myself, but straight from scripture.

    I believe our understanding of time is off, and how time progresses since time began. Now this is just an opinion that either we are wrong about the age of fossils or time somehow moved slower the further back you go.

    Whether that is the case or not doesn't matter. I am determined to only believe what is written between Genesis and Revelation, and according to that book the 7th rest day is 7000 years long, and that means that's the length of the other creative days. As well all land animals were created on the 6th day, and if you disagree with that simplest of understandings, in my opinion you impose your own understanding.

    Regardless, none of these subjects have any effect on the time of the end, our survival or service to Jehovah in any way, and not sure why it's such a high point lately.
     
  18. Josh:

    What scripture tells us that each of the creative days is of the same length?

    Frank
     
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    Joshuastone7

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    How many years has it been since Adam was created, as well, how many years has it been since we know the 7th hadn't started yet? We have not yet reached the 6000th year since the 7th day had begun.

    Then there's a 1000 years of Christ's rule ahead...

    Now, where does it say the creative days are not the same length? So then what is the simplest answer?
     
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    Domenic

    Domenic Guest

    I agree Josh7. Jehovah does not jump all over the place...if one was 7,000 years, I feel sure he would have all the other days 7,000 years.
    I feel the same about the trees in the bible, if 99% of the trees are symbolic, they would all be symbolic.

    Understanding if what is in scripture is real, or symbolic would be the key to understanding scripture. Example: The JW's say only 144,000 will go to heaven. I believe that to be symbolic. It says they are to be taken from when Jesus died. JW's claim no others are going to heaven. I believe they have that wrong. I believe the 144,000 number is symbolic because it is a perfect number:
    12 times 12 is 144 times 1,000=144,000.
     
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